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MOM Rule change required?
Holdfast
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#056
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 12:32 AM UTC
With atoplu winning the MOM in successive months it brings up the question of do we allow a winner in one month to win the following month? Now don't get me wrong as I have no problems with atoplu winning it's just that I would like to see all entrants win and a comment in the winner announcement thread got me thinking. I also believe that in other MOMs on other Kitmaker sites that this is the norm. Anyway I propose that:
a. The winner of a MOM cannot win the following month.

b. The winner of a MOM cannot win the following month. The member may enter and be the voted for, but if the entry should win then the second place will take the prize.

c. The winner of a MOM cannot win the following month. The member may enter but will not be included in the vote. The entry would just appear in the contest thread but not in the gallery.

"C" is my prefered option.

Mal
Merlin
Staff MemberSenior Editor
AEROSCALE
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 12:38 AM UTC
Hi Mal

I think allowing an entry that can't be voted for would just prove confusing. It would be simpler to simply say that any winner can't enter the following month's competition.

All the best

Rowan
FalkeEins
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 12:43 AM UTC

Quoted Text

a comment in the winner announcement thread got me thinking.


..
agree with Rowan...

..also ...a little more controversial perhaps ..but I personally would prefer not to see MOM entries elsewhere ...other build/campaign threads etc ..ie MOM entries should be exclusive to the competition....that also seems to me to be logical...

cheers
Tarok
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 12:56 AM UTC
Over on HF's SFOTM we have merely stipulated the winner, like staff members, are not eligible for the prize the following month.

To prevent these folks from entering will reduce the number of entries. Similarly would preventing campaign entries. When the number of entries are already low... you have to make certain allowances.
05Sultan
#037
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 02:10 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

a comment in the winner announcement thread got me thinking.


..
agree with Rowan...

..also ...a little more controversial perhaps ..but I personally would prefer not to see MOM entries elsewhere ...other build/campaign threads etc ..ie MOM entries should be exclusive to the competition....that also seems to me to be logical...

cheers


I'm afraid I can't agree with this suggestion. I build slowly compared to others and if I get one done then that alone is an accomplishment deserving a prize! .Campaigns are for comraderie whereas contests are indiviual satisfaction. Nothing wrong with getting some 'milage' for your efforts.
cheers!
CMOT70
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 02:34 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

a comment in the winner announcement thread got me thinking.


..
agree with Rowan...

..also ...a little more controversial perhaps ..but I personally would prefer not to see MOM entries elsewhere ...other build/campaign threads etc ..ie MOM entries should be exclusive to the competition....that also seems to me to be logical...

cheers


Well i haven't really been around here long so won't comment too much on the suggested rule changes. Though i can see one immediate problem with excluding campaign/build threads...there would be half the entries from the couple of MOM's that i've seen. And the advantage of campaign and build thread entries is that everyone knows they were definately completed that month anyway.

Andrew
camogirl
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 04:39 AM UTC
I agree with not being able to win consecutive months and I think models models built for campaigns (or ones in build threads) etc should still be allowed to enter as we all know for definate the kit was finished in the month and a lot of hard work goes into the campign builds etc.
Henk
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 04:40 AM UTC
We decided on the Anonymous entry of models in the Dragon Model of the Month competition on Armorama, to give every entry the same exposure. Therefore it was requested that the entrants refrained from posting their entry in other forums, to keep the playing field equal for all. So far this has worked fine.
We did at the same time ask the entrants to submit at least ten photo's, as we are using the entries for On Display features in the month following the contest. So instead of a thread which drops of the page, the entrants get a feature (with the home page head line) to their name (also added to their profile of course).

Also, we don't make the voting gallery visible until voting starts, again to give each model equal exposure.

Cheers
Henk
Tomcat31
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 04:52 AM UTC

Quoted Text

b. The winner of a MOM cannot win the following month. The member may enter and be the voted for, but if the entry should win then the second place will take the prize.
This is my preferred option as I feel the other two would be difficult for the staff to "Police"


Quoted Text

..also ...a little more controversial perhaps ..but I personally would prefer not to see MOM entries elsewhere ...other build/campaign threads etc ..ie MOM entries should be exclusive to the competition....that also seems to me to be logical...
I agree with everyone else that this would be the wrong way to go as it could be detrimental to the MOM if this was enforced especially as its still in its infancy. I for one am working on a Buccaneer and have been for the last few months and started a build thread in the process. When its finished it I intend on entering it in the MOM. If the rule was to be enforced this would preclude me for any further entries as most of my builds now are either for campaigns, or are in build threads as I do these so some of my clients can see the progression of the model I'm building for them.
Holdfast
Staff MemberPresident
IPMS-UK KITMAKER BRANCH
#056
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 06:40 AM UTC
Neil, I understand where you are coming from as regards you suggestion but, because of the infancy of the MOM and the few who enter, this, I feel, would be a negative move. I actually think that it is better to see a model posted in the forums and/or in the campaigns throughout it's build. This way you know for sure that it was completed in the month in which it was entered. A model that suddenly appears in the MOM, when it hasn't appeared on the site before, can be a bit suspicious.

Rowan

Quoted Text

I think allowing an entry that can't be voted for would just prove confusing. It would be simpler to simply say that any winner can't enter the following month's competition.


This would be the easiest and simplest of options. Any more takers?

Mal
Henk
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Posted: Sunday, October 21, 2007 - 02:50 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I think allowing an entry that can't be voted for would just prove confusing. It would be simpler to simply say that any winner can't enter the following month's competition.


When we introduced this rule in the Armorama DMoM competition, nobody disagreed. The previous 'regular' winners did not have a problem with giving others a slice of the cake so to speak.

Henk
lampie
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Posted: Monday, October 22, 2007 - 12:13 AM UTC
Sorry for the late reply. Ive been away.
I would suggest that the MoM winner is not eligable to enter for the following month. Allowing entries that are not included in the voting would only cause confusion.
Keep it simple... If you win,,take a month off
Nige
Blackwulf
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Posted: Monday, October 22, 2007 - 04:54 AM UTC
My two cents--do not place this stipulation. If someone is capable of producing beautiful work--reward them for it. After all. people are winning based upon what their peers think. Why discourage people from entering. Maybe if someone wins in successive months, a prize could also be given to the runner up or just take away the prizes altogether. I would hate to think that we "punish" someone for their talents.

How about categories? I know its been bounced around and I know it would be a lil harder but it might be feasible. For Example:

(With a minimum of 3 entries)

Early aviation until WW2

WW2

Post WW2 through modern

Even if there are no rewards--just having your peers recognize you should be reward in itself. I know that I lean towards WW2 aircraft personally--I might look at a jet and think that it looks good but my tendency may be to vote for the WW2 planes(because I love them and I am more familiar with them). If Jets were separate--I know that I could focus only on them and choose accordingly.

I hope this wasnt too long and rambling and I know the things i have discussed have been said before. My intent was not to beat up on the system--I think it has been moving along very well. Hopefully a sensible method will come out of everyone's comments.
CaptainA
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Posted: Monday, October 22, 2007 - 07:39 AM UTC
Samantha got it right. (It may come back to haunt her one day) Rowan also got it right.

Let everybody enter. Previous winner not eligible to win the prize, even though they may win the vote.

Entries in campaigns can be followed to make sure they were finished in the month of the contest.

Remember, nobody reads the rules, as evidenced by the number of pictures posted in the MOM thread, so lets keep it real simple.
Holdfast
Staff MemberPresident
IPMS-UK KITMAKER BRANCH
#056
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Posted: Friday, October 26, 2007 - 07:48 PM UTC
Patrick

Quoted Text

My two cents--do not place this stipulation. If someone is capable of producing beautiful work--reward them for it. After all. people are winning based upon what their peers think. Why discourage people from entering. Maybe if someone wins in successive months, a prize could also be given to the runner up or just take away the prizes altogether. I would hate to think that we "punish" someone for their talents.


I agree with you, however, if the same person wins every month, then others wont bother to enter and the MOM will die. Dragon award the prizes and, at the moment, there isn't one for the runners up. It is also important to remember that ths is actually a photogrphic competition, so a very well built model, photographed badly is at a disadvantage, the opposite is also, somewhat, true. One of the aims of the MOM is to encourage the taking of better pictures.

Models should definately be allowed to be showcased on Aeroscale, in fact I'm considering making it compulsery to have a build thread, for the same reason Samantha outlined,

Quoted Text

as we all know for definate the kit was finished in the month

At the moment this is taken on trust.

Carl

Quoted Text

Remember, nobody reads the rules, as evidenced by the number of pictures posted in the MOM thread, so lets keep it real simple.


Not strictly true as only 2 members have not posted in the contest thread and one of those regularly plays this game and now, after failing, since the begining of this new MOM, to atract his attention, I will simply delete the entry, the other I will PM.

I will make the rule change:
"A winner one month cannot win the following month".
This, of course, will not effect Aytoplu this month.

Thanks for you input

Mal
CaptainA
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Posted: Sunday, October 28, 2007 - 03:08 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Carl

Quoted Text

Remember, nobody reads the rules, as evidenced by the number of pictures posted in the MOM thread, so lets keep it real simple.


Not strictly true as only 2 members have not posted in the contest thread and one of those regularly plays this game and now, after failing, since the begining of this new MOM, to atract his attention, I will simply delete the entry, the other I will PM.

Mal


Yes you are right. I should have said some people do not read, or totally ignore the rules. When I posted that comment, there were two entrants that had posted 4 pictures in the thread where it says to post 3 (THREE) pictures. I could have posted 4 or more pictures to get more exposure. But I am more apt to follow the rules, as are most of the competition.

I think you are doing a great job supervising the contest. I really like the idea of having a build thread for models to be entered in the MOM. I also apologize if I ruffled tha tail feathers of any of you entrants that follow the rules all the time.
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