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NEWS
1:48 P-61A Black Widow
Merlin
Staff MemberSenior Editor
AEROSCALE
#017
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United Kingdom
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Posted: Monday, June 27, 2011 - 02:47 AM UTC
Great Wall Hobby look set to follow the success of their Fw 189 with their next release - the Northrop P-61A Black Widow. Thanks to Guido Hopp for sending us CAD images of the kit which is due for release next month.

Link to Item



If you have comments or questions please post them here.

Thanks!
NickZour
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Attica, Greece / Ελλάδα
Joined: May 01, 2008
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Posted: Monday, June 27, 2011 - 05:08 AM UTC
These are fantastic news
Mr. Damian got to see it


Cheers Nick
vanize
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Texas, United States
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Posted: Monday, June 27, 2011 - 05:23 AM UTC
WOOT!
TedMamere
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Moselle, France
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Posted: Monday, June 27, 2011 - 07:07 AM UTC
Excellent news indeed!
Merlin
Staff MemberSenior Editor
AEROSCALE
#017
_VISITCOMMUNITY
United Kingdom
Joined: June 11, 2003
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Posted: Monday, June 27, 2011 - 09:13 AM UTC

Quoted Text

These are fantastic news
Mr. Damian got to see it


Cheers Nick



Hi Nick

Yes, that was my first thought too. Something tells me Damian might be quite excited!

All the best

Rowan
bdanie6
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New Hampshire, United States
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Posted: Monday, June 27, 2011 - 11:11 AM UTC
WOO-HOO!! Yes,yes,yes! Finally! uh-oh... how much?
AussieReg
Staff MemberAssociate Editor
AUTOMODELER
#007
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Victoria, Australia
Joined: June 09, 2009
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Posted: Monday, June 27, 2011 - 04:40 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Yes, that was my first thought too. Something tells me Damian might be quite excited!

All the best

Rowan



Well whatever would give you guys THAT idea

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!!

I wonder if I will get a discount if I order a 20' container full of them ??

Thanks for posting this great news, I might just have a small celebratory dance in my office (when nobody is looking).

Cheers, D
Mecenas
Joined: December 23, 2007
KitMaker: 1,596 posts
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Posted: Monday, June 27, 2011 - 07:24 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I wonder if I will get a discount if I order a 20' container full of them ??

Cheers, D



Go ahead and try! I will help you to build all these kits Vacation break has just begun in Poland, why not to spend it in Australia? I've never been in Australia yet...
shivadog
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Warszawa, Poland
Joined: August 09, 2009
KitMaker: 42 posts
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Posted: Monday, June 27, 2011 - 09:01 PM UTC
I can also build one, even in Australia.
Hope they will also make gun turret version soon.

j
Berlin45
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Washington, United States
Joined: June 25, 2009
KitMaker: 96 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 - 07:28 PM UTC
O... M... G...

I'll DIE if they tool up an F-15E Reporter!
GastonMarty
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Quebec, Canada
Joined: April 19, 2008
KitMaker: 595 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 - 08:47 PM UTC

I hate to pre-judge a kit before the actual plastic is displayed, but come on... IF this CAD is a correct representation of the kit (and I did say IF)... Then it is an utter disaster... I can't believe a new-tool kit would simply use the old Monogram kit as a reference and ignore the Dragon 1/72 kit... Or reality...

Are drawings ever going to stop ruining kits?

See what I mean here:




See as well where the "inspiration" of the above CAD horror comes from, and just below the Dragon 1/72 that actually has the good sense of ignoring the Monogram's entire front end...:




I got upset over some features of the FW-189 (the straight booms, boxy canopy), because I toiled over fixing those the wrong way around on the MPM. But it was still an immense improvement over the MPM kit...

If this is really happening the way it seems to be happening on the P-61, a repeat of the Monogram kit's errors after 38 years of waiting, that's it... I'm going to the monastery...

Joking aside, I think it's just an early CAD display version, and that this just isn't happening... It can't be: The Chinese have their very own P-61 to measure, in the Beijing museum if I am not mistaken...

No, this just can't be happening....

Gaston
betheyn
Staff MemberSenior Editor
AEROSCALE
#019
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England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: October 14, 2004
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Posted: Tuesday, June 28, 2011 - 11:43 PM UTC
Now do my eyes deceive me or is there an "extra frame" around the side window, causing it not to be level with the rest of the framework.




Now Gaston please go find somewhere else to play, or take up a different hobby.
Andy
P.S Images taken from various Internet sites, where it is believed, by some, only the correct scale plans, photos and documentation can be found .
lampie
#029
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England - East Midlands, United Kingdom
Joined: December 23, 2005
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Posted: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 12:02 AM UTC

Ah here we go, I didn't think it would take long for you turn up Sherwood/Gaston or whatever your name is.


Quoted Text

I hate to pre-judge a kit before the actual plastic is displayed,



No you don't,,you love to do it.
It makes your world go round.

An expert on the P-61 as well now are you?
How many years are you going to spend correcting this one?
Can't wait!

I shall look forward to seeing how quickly you can turn another kit into a pile of filler and plastic card held together by sanding dust and the remains of the kit parts.
As sad as it may seem, there are times I actually enjoy and look forward to your posts depicting your obsessive butchery of plastic, spending days reducing the thickness and depth of the area of a model only to then go back and attempt to return it to its original shape, while continuing to dig yourself in deeper and deeper, running around in circles pontificating about the shortcomings and inaccurate dimensions of almost every single model aircraft kit which is released.
Actually..BEFORE it is released. Thats my particular favourite, when you havent even seen the bloody thing!!

I'm sure the P-61 kit will have some innacuracies, every kit does,but 99.99999999percent of modellers,aviation fans,historians,veterans,historians,general public,dogs,horses, guinea pigs and goldfish will neither notice of care.


Quoted Text

If this is really happening the way it seems to be happening on the P-61, a repeat of the Monogram kit's errors after 38 years of waiting, that's it... I'm going to the monastery...



Be carefull the door here doesn't bang you on the butt on the way out.

Nige
SunburntPenguin
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Australian Capital Territory, Australia
Joined: March 15, 2011
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Posted: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 12:14 AM UTC
Nige

Didn't you realise that Gaston is the only person qualified to judge the accuracy of any kit that is released?
lampie
#029
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England - East Midlands, United Kingdom
Joined: December 23, 2005
KitMaker: 6,249 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 12:22 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Nige

Didn't you realise that Gaston is the only person qualified to judge the accuracy of any kit that is released?



Personally,, I would like to see him get his own forum sub section on here to save searching
He's a class act thats for sure.
If I ever find myself in Quebec I'd be tempted to look him him up and let him by me a beer!

Nige
SunburntPenguin
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Australian Capital Territory, Australia
Joined: March 15, 2011
KitMaker: 121 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 01:06 AM UTC
He'd have to buy me more than one beer!!!
BlackWidow
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European Union
Joined: August 09, 2009
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Posted: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 08:53 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

These are fantastic news
Mr. Damian got to see it


Cheers Nick



Hi Nick

Yes, that was my first thought too. Something tells me Damian might be quite excited!

All the best

Rowan



Not just Damian is excited about this news, because I am, too! How long have we waited for a new P-61 kit now? Well, it's only 37 years folks! Actually I thought Hasegawa might come out with a new Widow in the future. But I will happily take this one, too. Must have a look in the box when I have the chance. I wonder if there is a clear part for the nose (or "milk glass"). I missed that in the old Monogram kit. Hope there are some new decals in it. Otherwise Aeromaster will help out.
I think this Black Widow will look fine beside my other 2 I have built last year for the twin boom campaign ....
Oh, and I don't care about some minor inaccuracies, because every kit has it. Just talk to visitors on expos and you know what I mean.

Happy modelling!
Torsten
AussieReg
Staff MemberAssociate Editor
AUTOMODELER
#007
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Victoria, Australia
Joined: June 09, 2009
KitMaker: 8,156 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 04:08 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I hate to pre-judge a kit before the actual plastic is displayed . . .



Then don't !!
GastonMarty
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Quebec, Canada
Joined: April 19, 2008
KitMaker: 595 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 05:14 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Now do my eyes deceive me or is there an "extra frame" around the side window, causing it not to be level with the rest of the framework.




Now Gaston please go find somewhere else to play, or take up a different hobby.
Andy
P.S Images taken from various Internet sites, where it is believed, by some, only the correct scale plans, photos and documentation can be found .



I don't understand WHY the extra side-window frame has anything to with what I am pointing out...

The blue-red vector lines I added are pretty self-explanatory, and if they are not enough (as is apparently the case), then those who don't get it are beyond ANY explanation...

Let's just pray those CADs are pure ridiculous nonsense... But then, why are they showing this Monogram-imitation stuff as advertising?

Oh, and is the Dragon kit inaccurate, is that what you are saying?

Ever had the curiosity of comparing the two?

Gaston

Tailor
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Nordrhein-Westfalen, Germany
Joined: May 26, 2008
KitMaker: 1,168 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 - 07:44 PM UTC
Gentlemen,
I see that the release of the GWH P-61A meets quite a bit of interest and - of cause- stirs some discussion about accuracy right from the start.
Of cause Gaston is known to find even the smallest fly in the ointment, however I thought the issue well worth forwarding to the GWH planners to counter check. (Thanks for the pointer, Rowan and thanks for the input, Gaston!) I doubt that anything will be changed now that they are on the brink of picking up full scale production. In any case such hints may still have an influence on future projects.
The CAD shown is used to program the machining of the moulds, so they are far from being nonsense. Thinking that just taking the yardstick to the bird standing in Beijing is all one needs to make a perfect model is quite naive and I am sorry to say it - shows that the person has about no idea what it takes to make a buildable and affordable scale model kit.
Of cause the researching, planning and designing has taken up a good bit of time with lots of reworking and redoing in due process to present the modeller with the best possible choice of model kit in the market. However, I want to remind the modeller that EVERY model is a blend of compromises between accuracy, feasibility and affordability. In any case, I am convinced that the final product will be the best P-61A kit in any scale to date, even though it may have deficiencies in the eye of some of the beholders.
Thank you for your kind attention.
Cheers,
Guido
GastonMarty
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Quebec, Canada
Joined: April 19, 2008
KitMaker: 595 posts
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Posted: Thursday, June 30, 2011 - 07:39 PM UTC
I am glad to hear there is a small chance the model's canopy will not match the CADs we have seen.

With the quite plausible Dragon 1/72 canopy being at least a decade old if not more (whatever other troubles the Dragon kit may have), there is no reason for a new release to be a step back in the critical canopy area.

Since my criticism basically concerns one single part, I was hoping it was not too late despite the stated release date. I am fairly sure the change could be limited to the cockpit clear parts alone....

I really do care about this particular release, and a canopy similar to Monogram's (as the CADs appear to show) would be a huge let-down to anyone who has waited 38 years for this kit....

Gaston

P.S. I certainly should thank Guido Hopp for forwarding my concerns. This is a critical release and deserve to be done right.

G.









Littorio
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England - South East, United Kingdom
Joined: September 15, 2004
KitMaker: 4,728 posts
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Posted: Friday, July 01, 2011 - 10:24 AM UTC
Great news, a new P-61A.

It looks like a P-61 so that's fine with me, here's hoping they do the P-61B and F-15 Reporter.
As for decals check out Kitsworld
Tailor
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Nordrhein-Westfalen, Germany
Joined: May 26, 2008
KitMaker: 1,168 posts
AeroScale: 199 posts
Posted: Friday, July 01, 2011 - 06:31 PM UTC
... more great P-61 decals are available from Zotz, too.
Cheers,
Guido
Tailor
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Nordrhein-Westfalen, Germany
Joined: May 26, 2008
KitMaker: 1,168 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, July 05, 2011 - 11:01 PM UTC
Hallo, friends!
I have been spending hours to find out what Gaston's problem is with the canopy. I know, that many don't even consider his comments worth reading and I have received a number of e-mails encouraging me to ignore them. However, I don't really sleep well with such things on my mind. I guess one of the major problems is that he draws a couple of lines onto the CAD and expects everyone to be able to see his point. So I have been pooring over pictures plans and schematics. Now that in the other thread the sprue shots can be seen and Gaston is still all over it he now mentiones that the canopy should taper of towards the rear and calls on model kit in 1/72 as a reference. After studying I am reasonably sure that he doens't have a point:
Here are magnifactions of the SAME cad seem from different perspectives:



same CAD rotated 180:



same CAD rotated another 45, level out and zoomed in:



As you can see the sliding window in a tiny tad bit samller than the window behind it.

Here are a few pics to show that indeed the upper and lower frame are paralell if seen from a level perspective:





Our friend Gaston lets himself get fooled by the vertical frames being curved while the fuselage is getting wider at the same time. In the following picture it looks af if the height of the front window is different from the one towards the rear. But if you measure and compensate for an approximate angle they are the same height. As old Obi-Wan said: The eyes can betray you! Don't trust them.



Now I am quite certain it won't convince any one who does not want to be convinced, but I rest assured that do deviler a 99,8% correct canopy. A 0,2% error rate for scale compensation is pretty good, I say, but of cause it won't be enough for a certain type of modeller.

Now I am looking forward to getting the sprues! Not long now!

Guido
Jonathan_Mock
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United Kingdom
Joined: February 07, 2011
KitMaker: 24 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, July 06, 2011 - 08:55 PM UTC




Are these photos of your own models Gaston or are they other people's that you are uploading and sharing from your Photobucket account with their permission - like my images that you uploaded and shared from your Photobucket account and refused to remove despite my repeated requests, and which was only finally resolved by Photobucket taking direct action.

Simple question, your images and do you have permission, yes or no?
 _GOTOTOP