I know the P-61 Black Widow was black - however, any suggestions which paint to use, and gloss or flat. Thanks

The specification called for gloss paint, but it very quickly weathered, especially in the Pacific. On models, semi-gloss or satin finish works best as a starting point because full gloss makes it look like a toy.

Hello Vic,

Not all P-61 were all black. Some units had them painted olive-drab. However, if you did go all black it would be gloss black.

www.olive-drab.com/idphoto/id_photos_fighters_p61.php

See ya in the funnies...................

FWIW, Airfix P-61A in rattle can gloss black

As Jessica alluded to, the tropical sun, and salt air quickly dulled the gloss finish, and faded the paint. So unless you're doing a brand new aircraft, at best go with semi gloss black.

I've just started painting my GWH 1/48 scale P-61 A-5. For a base color I used Tamiya Semi Gloss Black. Then started to fad the upper panels with a mixture of flat black and Neutral Gray in a random pattern.

After decaling, further weathering will deal with normal wear and tear from operational use, and the effects of the tropical environment.

Joel

I believe P-61's, the ones that were painted black, initially were painted flat black. It turned out that if caught in a searchlights beam, it looked like a nice sillouhette of the aircraft was visible. (did I spell sillouhette right LOL)
The change was then made to paint the black P-61's gloss black; but as everyone has already said, certainly in the Pacific, and I would think to a lesser extent in Europe, the gloss finish faded due to wear and exposure to the elements. Russell

The purpose of the matt black finish was as a countermeasure to searchlights, for which it was quite effective and ordinary gloss black paint is not much of an improvement.

Silhouetting is not a problem with searchlights as the light source has to be behind to do that. It is a problem against the background of the night sky, especially in moonlight, which is actually surprisingly light. In these circumstances black is not an effective camouflage so RAF night fighters adopted a different, lighter, camouflage whilst matt black was retained as under surface colour on aircraft that were expected to encounter searchlights.

ln the UK, experiments with night camouflage finishes carried out during the 1930s had focused on developing a black paint which was sufficiently matt to absorb any light shining upon it. In the USA, unlike in the UK, when such finishes were found to be unsatisfactory, trials were carried out with smoother paints. This led to a dull but smooth black finish, Bulletin 41 No 44 being adopted for the P-70 in 1st October 1941 .

The Office of Scientific Research's camouflage section, which was located at Massachusetts Institute of Technology, suggested that a very smooth and highly glossy black finish would be even more effective as it would reflect the light away from any observer who was not observing the aircraft at exactly the correct angle (referred to as the 'specular angle') to see the reflected light. (In simple terms it is the light that is scattered or dispersed that makes the aircraft visible. By reducing the amount if scattered light the aircraft is much harder to see.)

Trials with such a finish were apparently put in hand at Eglin Field during the summer of 1943 which led to Eglin Field report No 3-43-1 14 'Test of glossy paint for Night camouflage' being published on 10th December 1943. This stated that comparable tests conducted at Eglin Field with aircraft finished with a special black paint of high specular and low diffuse reflectance and an aircraft finished with the standard matt black paint had been carried out. The matt black aircraft appeared 'silvery' white in searchlights whilst the glossy black aircraft was invisible 75 percent of the time and the effectiveness of both optically and radar controlled searchlights was greatly reduced except at the specular angle. Eglin Field recommended that the special black paint be standardised and replace the standard matt black.

Following the submission of this report, US Material Command initiated the use of Gloss Black camouflage paint on 12 January 1944. It requested that all night fighter aircraft in production, the P-61 and P-70, be camouflaged with gloss black paint. This order superseded all previous orders for the camouflage of Night Fighters.

The Engineering Division at Wright Field assigned this new gloss black paint the ANA designation No 622 and named it 'Jet'. On 15th March 1944 they had stated that it would be added to the list of standard aircraft camouflage colours listed in ANA Bulletin No. 157 as soon as possible. This however did not take place until the issue of ANA Bulletin No. 157b on 20th August 1946, about a year after the end of the war.

A quantity of the paint was made available to the British to carry out trials. ICI carried out experiments to manufacture the finish using pigment supplied from the USA which was very finely ground. Trials were carried out of a number of Halifax IIIs.

The findings of the trial were set out in RAE Report No. Ch. 4.10 dated May 1944. The report concluded that the glossy camouflage made it appreciably more difficult for the searchlights to find their target and there was some evidence to suggest that it also made it more difficult for the target to be held. ln general the glossy finish increased the difficulty of seeing the illuminated target from the ground, the effect being increased with distance. At close range, however, the target was more easily seen. The glossy camouflage was found to interfere with recognition by giving less uniform definition with confusing highlights.

Great care was necessary in avoiding scratches on this finish and in removal of dirt, oil etc. Affected areas were to be touched up as soon as possible to maintain the smooth glossy finish which was an essential requirement.

The materials were stated to be Special Glossy Black (Synthetic) - 1 gallon Stores reference 33B/642 (lCl number 27-100261 and its special thinners stores ref 33B/643 (lCl number 149-585) for half a gallon for metal surfaces and Special Glossy Black (Nitro Cellulose) 33B/644 (lCl number 212- 1160) and its thinners 33B/645 (lCl number 327- 348) for fabric surfaces.

Accumulation of dirt was not to be removed in any circumstances by dry rubbing but with soap and water liberally applied with rags. With careful attention in this respect, it was estimated that the finish would maintain its properties for about six months. The finish was never to be polished as even wax polishing had proved to be detrimental causing an increase in diffuse reflection. It was preferable to apply the finish direct onto bare metal after it had been degreased, but where it was necessary to apply it over a component already treated with primer or painted, at least two coats of the glossy black would be necessary On bare metal, one coat should be sufficient. When touching up, the previous finish was to be well rubbed down with dry carborundum paper (Stores ref.33C/648) and all dust removed before application of the paint. Any painting or touching up of this finish should be carried out in a hangar away from any further dust which might collect on the drying paint. Absolute cleanliness was essential at all times.

Post war, the finish was adopted as Anti Searchlight Glossy Black.

Antoni, thanks for that information. I can understand how gloss would be harder to see from the ground as light would bounce off at the same angle it hits the aircraft, while matt paint reflects the light at multi angles due to the nooks and crannies of the finish.

Joel