Hi everyone
Does anyone know where i can find camo pattern of me 109 e4 used by I/JG27 during battle of britain. I've searched web, but I found information about I/JG27 in north africa only .

hi mate!

i' ve got an idea for you

go to teh "decal review section " of www.modellingmadness.com

and look after your craft ....MANY profiles there!

succez

cheerz Q!

Marcin- I've got a copy of Uwe Feist's Bf109 in combat at home. I can check for you but I can't give you an answer until tomorrow.
Also, look in my Gallery under Bf109. It may already be there.

Thank you both.
lordQ - your link doesn't work now, so i'll try later.
I found in your gallery two pictures of me 109 of I/jg27 (bf 109_005 and bf 109_009) but both shows desert camo, so can wait until tomorrow.

sorry sorry sorry,

made a writing mistake

www.modelingmadness.com

cheerz Q!

Hi Marcin, are you after a particular aircraft 1/JG 27 or will any do? I have 1 profile of a Bf 109E-4 from 1/JG 27, white 11. Have another Bf109E-4 from Stab 1/JG 27. Both thes aircraft are depicted in September 1940 but are painted very differently.
Mal

Hi Mal
I have decals for black 9 with red sorrundings (i can make 6 of it of course) from desert me -109 kit. I hope that planes with such markings took part in BoB.
I found on modelingmadness.com camo pattern for I/JG27 during BoB but only side.

Marcin-
I had a look in the book last night & unfortunately the only Photo specifically of a JG/27 Bf109 was a small Black & White shot of an early E model shot down on the coast of the Channel. It would appear that the scheme was simple Dunkelgrun/lichtgrun mottle all the way down to the wing. The two shots in my gallery (005 & 009) are not Afrika trop. camo, They are Lichtgrun/dunkelgrun uppersuface mottle (not splinter on the wings-no explanation for that) with Lichtgrauon the fuselage shading to Lichtblau on the undersurfaces.This A/C is an E-4, the first model with the Improved Canopy structure & added armorglass. They were delivered to JG's in France (according to Mr. Feist) inlate'40/early '41, certainly enough time for BoB. (This canopy is known as the "Galland Hood", as then Major Galland requested the change while flying with JG/27, and Implemented when he took command of JG/26)

Mal, my research is limited to three older print volumes supplemented by 'net research. Feel free to jump in & correct any of my suppositions at anytime...

Marcin, If you'd like I can check the B&W photo tonight to see what markings were carried on that particular Aircraft. Just let me know here or by PM

Ok Robert, so which colors I should use to paint such camo as in your gallery (f.e. in testors or humbrol pallet) and wuold it be correct for plane from I/JG27 with black number surrounded with red line on fuselage?

OK Marcin,
I don't think that any Bf 109s had those sort of codes during the BoB. I have found a black 6 with yellow surrounds but none the same as you have. My source is Combat colours number 1, The Messerschmitt Bf 109E on the Western Front- 1940. It has a lot of profiles and other info.

I believe you should try another tack As it seems that you want to do a model of a BoB Bf 109 then don't let the fact that you don't have the right markings get in your way. This is Armorama and I'm sure those that are able to will help you to aquire the markings that you require
First of all which model do you have?
Are there any other markings in the kit, other than the desert ones?
Would you like to do a simple or complicated scheme?
If you look at the top of the page you will see My model of Gallands Bf 109E-4. You would need an airbrush to do this. I will post a pic later of a much simpler scheme. when we know what it is you would like to do I'm positve that between us we can get together the required markings. So if you can answer those few questions, I'll look at getting pics of a couple more 109s posted. Anybody else with pics of 109 E models, so Marcin can see what he might want to do?
Mal

Marcin-
At this point I'm going to defer to Mal, as I'm sure he's forgotten more about this Topic then i'll ever know.
You may get some use out of this site, though, once you get the colors you want-
http://www.airmodel.sk/english/topcolor.html
Just go to the RLM section of the site & look up the German name. It'll crossref it to Humbrol, etc.

Mal, If you don't mind you could take a peek at the Bf109 pics in my Gallery & see if you know the exact colors of 005,007, &009. Or If you have a copy of Uwe Feist's "The Fighting 109", It's in the colour plate section.

Robert


I don't know about that
I took a look at the profiles in your gallery curious


Is this what it says in the book? Older volumes are notoriously out of touch with current thinking on WWII Luftwaffe camouflage.
I would suggest that certainly 009 is Tropical camo, consisting of RLM 78 Light Blue undersurfaces, with RLM 79 Sandgelb (sand yellow) uppersurfaces, with a mottle of RLM 80 Olivegrun (olive green) This aircraft has an african theatre, white, band around the fuselage and an Africa corps emblem on the nose.
I would also suggest that the other E-4N is in tropical camo as well as it appears to have white tips to the underside of the wings, another African theatre marking.
If you are refering to the F-2 model at the bottom of the 3 in 005 this appears to be totally wrong as JG 54 (Grunhartz) aircraft on the Russian front were painted in a 3 colour camouflage. I could of course be wrong but all my references and my instinct tell me this is the case.
Here's my E-7 Trop in a similar camo to the 2 I think are Trops

I will try and post a pic of a JG 54 F-2 tomorrow, with some others from the BoB
Mal

Bingo. Y'see? Mal took me to school again
Thanks Mal!

so i was right about that camo. but the emblem on the nose is not affrica corp as i know. First on battle-of-britain.com (in squadron section) it is use as emblem of I/jg27 in BOB and on modelingmadness.com i found decals for me 109 of that squad for BOB plane with this emblem fron3/jg27 - red 12 (www.modelinmadness.com/scotts/decals/aero/am48238.htm). I read there that the emblem refers to german colony in africa, not to taking part of i/jg27 in africa's campaing (see: www.modelingmadness.com/scotts/decals/aero/am72073.htm )
The model that i have is old 1/72 matchbox 40017 kit of me 109 e4 (i don't have box of it) and on the instruction of assembly which is very poor (no camo pattern and no paint numbers sugetion) i have revell logo. I know that it's matchbox kit by it number (revell has four digit numbers). I the kit decals are provided for rumanian air force and that black 9 with red surrunding from i/jg 27(of course i had to find out by my self for what squad is that emblem.
It is not so important to make that model in bob camo. i just wanted to make it for battle for britain campaing.
I would choose simple pattern because deadline is 20th of Jan.

Yeah, you're right about the nose emblem the Africa corps emblem is, of course, the swastika with a palm tree on top of it. sorry couldn't think of what else to call it
Anyway, I think it's a bit late to try and round up decals for you by the 20th, but I've had another look in my reference and found a Bf 109E-1/B of 2./JG27 with red outline black 5. It's not in what I would call simple camoflage but If you are prepared to bend reasoning a little and why not. Then if 2./JG 27 had a red outlined black 5 they probably had a red outlined black 6 or even 9 (not strictly true but good enough) Do your model as an earlier version and we are there?
I haven't got time to do it tonight but I will try and scan some images and post some pics to give you an idea of what I'm talking about. Suffice to say if you painted your model in a similar fashion to this:

ie, RLM 65 Light blue undersurfaces, splinter camoflage upper surfaces, consisting of RLM 70 Black green and RLM 02 Grey green. I will try and scan the correct pattern for you. A Bf 109 in these colours with German crosses and a number in front of the fuselage cross will look like an early to mid BoB Messerschmitt. Without specific codes it won't be 100% accurate but in the time you have I don't think you can get markings together, unless anyone has a set of 1/72 decals they are willing to let you have.
Mal

On modellingmadness i found yellow 11 of 1/jg27 and red 12 of 3/jg27. at weekend i'll check in my spare box if i have suitable decals, if not i'll try to make stencil. yellow11
red12

These profiles show the 2 aircraft I first refered to from I./JG 27, the top one and the bottom. The bottom one would be easy to reproduce, if you are prepared to cut stencils. The chevron would be even easier than doing 11.


This one shows the red outline black 5 I was referinmg to but doing the Stab (white chevron) machine above would yield a more acurately marked aircraft.



The next 2 pics show the basice camo pattern.



Mal

Thank you very much. I think i have all i needed and i have to decide which plane i'll make.

great, best of luck, Hope I didn't cause to much confusion :-)
Mal

not to much but some confusion. As a kid i couldn't understand markings of wwii planes (both german and allies) maybe that's why i prefer armor modeling, but of course my modeling pasion was started with planes.

one more question: what shade of yellow should i use for nose and rudder?

RLM 04 Gelb is the correct colour, you should find it in most paint ranges.
Mal