_GOTOBOTTOM
General Aircraft: Contests
A monthly online photo contest. Show your work!
Hosted by Jim Starkweather
Changes to the MOM, maybe?
Holdfast
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#056
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 08:38 AM UTC
I have been asked a few questions about the way the MOM is run and, although this has been discussed before, there are new memebrs who have not see those discussions.

1. Should I enter the MOM ?

Quoted Text

If you win, it would appear to be a rigged competition and would scare off potential participants, to me.


2. Should we only allow models finished during the month be eligable?

Quoted Text

A model built FIVE years ago should not be entered into competition. the model should have been finished that month prior to the deadline for entry.


3. Should the "winner" of a MOM be allowed to enter the following month?

Quoted Text

, I feel for impartiality that the winner from last month should not be able to enter in to the next months competition. However I think that he should be, in the case of a tie, the Tie-breaker vote.


Do you consider the MOM to be fair and impartial?

Quoted Text

I am only pointing things out that should be taken into consideration for a more fair and impartial contest.


These are ligitamate questions and I have posted them here incase there is anyone else with the same feelings.
I do feel that this is being taken far to seriously, afterall this is not a competition, but a way to get more models showcased on the site.
I will step down if it is felt that I am cheating on the vote count, or that I should not enter as well as count the votes. However I would like to point out that the vote is open and I do not cheat! If someone else would like to do it then I don't have a problem with that. I would rather enter then count the votes.
Your opinions please, and do say what you think.
Mal
Teacher
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 08:46 AM UTC
Mal,
Although concerning 'wingy thingies', I gotta say you're doin' a great job! I personally see absolutely no problem with the way it's run. The members should lighten up a bit, it's meant to be a FUN competition......NOT a dire contest of skills. It's a fun way to encourage the users of this site to complete the wingy thingies instead of just starting them and then sitting back and wishin' they were armour modellers. Come on people......It's FUN for you to enter, and work for us to organise them. We really could do without people looking for problems where there aren't any.
Carry on Mal!

Vinnie
lapulid2
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 09:46 AM UTC
Mal,
I'm only a beginner, but I have voted for what has inspired me the most. At this point all I can do is observe and learn and without your model on the ballot I wouldn't have benefited from your awesome skill and very good presentation (nice pictures). Please continue submitting your entries so that maybe one day my skills improve enough that I can submit my own entry.
betheyn
Staff MemberSenior Editor
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 10:18 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Should I enter the MOM ?

A big YES. I entered last months MOM for the first time, i knew i wasn't going to win but by entering i could see how far i had progressed as a modeller since joining this site and putting into practice all i have learnt.
As it for being a rigged competition, that in my opinion is a load of rubbish. Yes you will have the usual suspects entering models every month who will get most of the votes, but they are always truly remarkable pieces of work that should be shown and displayed. I never vote for the modeller but the model itself.


Quoted Text

Should we only allow models finished during the month be eligible?

A model built 5 years ago might never see the light of day unless it's entered in MOM. Perhaps this should be voted on. As for myself i think they should be allowed ( i haven't got any models over a year old).

Quoted Text

Should the "winner" of a MOM be allowed to enter the following month?

Yes, they should be allowed to enter. Are Chelsea not allowed to try a win the Premiership again this season

Quoted Text

I will step down if it is felt that I am cheating on the vote count, or that I should not enter as well as count the votes. However I would like to point out that the vote is open and I do not cheat! If someone else would like to do it then I don't have a problem with that. I would rather enter then count the votes.

How can you cheat on the vote count when everyone can see the votes cast . Perhaps we should make it that you can't vote for your own entry. You are doing a great job Mal and i can't see the problem of you entering and counting the votes. Keep up the good work.
Thanks Andy
ShermiesRule
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 10:35 AM UTC
I don't think that models built years ago should be entered. I think they should be new builds only.

brandydoguk
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 03:12 PM UTC
Mal I think the MOM is fine as it is, you are doing a great job running it and as all votes are there for people to see there should be no suggestion of cheating.

As you sat it is a fun way of getting completed models showcased with the added effect of raising the standards of us mere mortals to try emulate those fantastic kits that have been voted the winner.



Quoted Text


.....to encourage the users of this site to complete the wingy thingies instead of just starting them and then sitting back and wishin' they were armour modellers.

Lol, isn't it true that "weathering" was invented for armour modellers so they could easilly hide all their mistakes? :-) :-) :-)
mother
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 04:58 PM UTC
Mal, first I want to say thanks for taking the time you put into the Aircraft MOM. It’s a great feature to show off ones model. Each month I look forward to seeing the different Aircrafts that the members build and getting the chance to vote or voted for. Your doing a super job, don’t change a thing!

As for you entering...why not. Can't see how that matters in any why, at all! As for models only entered during the month to be eligible, no...that shouldn't matter either. What is the difference between a 10 day old build compared to a 4 year old one. As for the winning modeler entering month after month, that should be a judgment call by said modeler. Even still he/she has the right to enter. Members have to remember that this is an open vote, and that if someone wins more than once then the members votes spoke.

As for what Teacher had said “The members should lighten up a bit“ I agree, something’s just get to serious and out of text. Mal, as I said at the beginning your doing a super job and I hope that you continue to stay on as the MOM leader and that you still enter each month, AND that nothing changes.
JPTRR
Staff MemberManaging Editor
RAILROAD MODELING
#051
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 05:27 PM UTC
Mal,

Enter away!

Any models are allowed, regardless of when built. Some modelers do not have time to build a kit a month, and some that have been in hibernation may rekindle their interest seeing their models entered.

I trust your vote counting integrity.

I haven't "won" yet but have no problem seeing you, or Jean-Luc, or some never-before-entered participant win month after month. If someone does not think last month's winner should win again, let the voter spread their votes around.

Mal is doing a great job, IMHO.
airraid
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 06:07 PM UTC
Mal
I have not entered any models in the M.O.M. .I think that this hobby of ours is sometimes taken far too seriously by some people.I make models for enjoyment not cudos but if one of my models attracts positive comments then I am well pleased.As for the time limit I have models on display at home that only my family and friends have seen so why should I not enter them in the M.O.M.Just because I built them some time ago.I am just as proud of a kit that I built five years ago as I am of the one I built last week.Remember you can satisfy some of the people some of the time but not all of the people all of the time.Keep up the good work.
Dennis
almonkey
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 06:40 PM UTC
has the same person won it twice in a row? i think its fine as it is i.e. a bit of fun. on the question of older models i personally like to enter my newer stuff because my modelling has improved from what i was doing five years ago, but why not simply have a thread for your older stuff? "the home for retired models" cos i have stuff thats never been on here, but i never get round to posting them
keep it fun guys, said the mushroom!
DaveCox
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 06:55 PM UTC
Mal, leave it just as it is. You'll never keep everybody happy and it's it seems to be working just fine.
For those that are unhappy with the format just remember that the 'model of the month' in Aircraft, Armor or Figures is not a serious competition; it's meant to encourage members to complete builds instead of stashing kits and to show their work on the site, whatever the level of ability.

You're doing a good job mate so hang in there and don't mind the few that have a moan from time to time - it's gonna happen whatever you do.
TedMamere
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 07:28 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I haven't "won" yet but have no problem seeing you, or Jean-Luc, or some never-before-entered participant win month after month.


Hi all!

Fred, this is exaggerated, I just "won" one time with a Circus Plane!

Did someone really used the word cheating? If yes that's bad! I never saw a more "transparent" voting system than yours! How could you cheat?
I have participated to some Modeling Madness contests as well and can assure you it's not that transparent! In fact everyone there participating could ask all his friends to vote per e-mail and win the contest... not here! I thinks the MOM voting system is perfect in that aspect.
This reminds me the guy that criticized the Aircraft Jeopardy because he thought some of us were sending ourselves PM's with answers! :-)
The votes in the MOM may appear strange sometimes, but remember each person is different! I will always give my votes to WW2 subjects rather than modern ones for example... I just can't do otherwise, it's in my nature, even if I know this is totally subjective! I think others are doing the same in the contrary...
To sum up Mal, the MOM is good as it is! Each month more and more are participating and this is, I think, a great reward for your excellent job on it.

To finish, and I said that before, you don't enter or vote for a model, but for the "picture of a model"

Jean-Luc
Merlin
Staff MemberSenior Editor
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#017
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 08:36 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Did someone really used the word cheating? If yes that's bad!


Hi there

I've read the original PM and it's important to say that there was never an accusation that Mal was cheating - simply concern that Mal's participation might give the appearance of such. The author just wants to see MoM be as popular and successful as possible - an aim I can see we all share.

We've tried several different styles of voting. Using a Poll or voting in the Gallery both had problems which could rightly lead to complaints of vote-rigging. The current method is the only way we've found that ensures that there can be no question of cheating - because all the votes are there for all to count. My only concern is about the amount of work it entails for Mal each month.

As regards what models are eligible and whether a winner can re-enter the following month - to be honest, I have no strong feelings one way or the other and am happy to go with the consensus.

So, Mal - keep up the great work you're doing and don't you dare think of stepping down!

All the best

Rowan
archerwin
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Posted: Friday, October 21, 2005 - 08:53 PM UTC
Mal,
I think you're doing a great service to all armorama flyboys by running this MOM. Personally, I'm motivated to finish atleast 1 model a month bec I want to join the MOM.

I also think that winning modellers should be allowed to enter their models in the MOM on the succeding months... I always like to see models from you, Tedmamere and the other winning modellers!

Thank you very much for sacrificing some of your modelling time to manage this MOM.

'till the next MOM,
archerwin
Grumpyoldman
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Posted: Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 12:05 AM UTC
I personally think you are doing fine Mal.
and the MOM is doing fine also.

No body is twisting any body's arm to enter it.
If they want to enter- fine, if they don't want to enter- that's fine also.

I must have missed the rule: "it's a life or death situation...." I always thought "HOBBY" meant pleasurable pass time.

The more you build the more you can enter... Gee--- really is that simple...... and since all the votes are plainly posted in the thread.... pretty hard to cheat.....

Let's see... did last month winner enjoy the MOM, how about the 2nd and 3rd place ???? What about all the regular every month entering members, that have been entering since this started? OH lets take their pleasure away, because some one else didn't win...... yeah that's fair....... Let's punish the winners, and not let them enter again....... what a brain dead idea that is...

If several people keep winning, HELL---MAYBE THEY BUILD BETTER MODELS!!!! and you might learn from them.....



Quoted Text

Your opinions please, and do say what you think


Well.... you asked......

:-) :-)
matrixone
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Posted: Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 03:39 AM UTC
Mal,
You are doing a great job running MOM and I see no reason for changing anything about MOM, it is fine as is.
I like being able every month to see a nice collection of models in one thread, and if it is an older model built years ago or a new model just finished I don't care, I still want to see it.

Please keep MOM the way it is.

Matrixone
OllieC-FWOL
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Posted: Sunday, October 23, 2005 - 01:27 AM UTC
I have no complaints about the MOM, but only a wee observation.

If it evers happen that one guy keeps winning month after month, there should be provision to keep him from winning 6 months in a stretch.

:-)
lapulid2
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Posted: Monday, October 24, 2005 - 01:35 AM UTC
Yeah, the provision should be someone should build a better model. keep the streak going thats what makes it fun. #:-)
newtothegame
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Posted: Monday, October 24, 2005 - 02:53 AM UTC
I think it is good the way it is. As for Mal participating, it would be a terrible loss if he didn't. He consistantly adds great looking models that members like me look to as goals for our own building!
Leon
ShermiesRule
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Posted: Monday, October 24, 2005 - 04:03 AM UTC
For some reason the older builds bother me. I mean someone could have 20 planes built 10 years ago and never have to lift a finger for MOM for nearly the next 2 years. To me the MOM is more a display of you latest builds rather than a showcase of your past builds. I think the personal gallery is for showcasing your collection while MOM is for heads up latest builds.

I guess I misunderstood
Holdfast
Staff MemberPresident
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#056
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Posted: Monday, October 24, 2005 - 09:02 AM UTC
OK guys and gals, I think that, apart from one or two slight misgivings, the MOM will stay as it is. Apart from the fact that I may have a small change just for November
Just to confirm, I wasn't accused of cheating, it was simply suggested that I could be accussed of cheating, because I run the MOM, enter in it and count the votes. If you check the votes and you think I have made a mistake, do say so. If I have disallowed a vote I will say why and If I'm wrong I'll correct it, I'm not infallable.


Quoted Text

I think the personal gallery is for showcasing your collection while MOM is for heads up latest builds.

There has been a little misunderstanding in certain areas about the reason for the MOM. It has 2 main aims, 1 to get more pictures of models into the "permanant" gallery and 2 to encourage members to take better quality pics (it is afterall a vote for the best "picture" of a model. I do believe that if we only allowed models completed in the month to be eligable for the MOM we would be lucky to have 1 entry a month.
We need to be encouraging more members to enter, not finding ways to discourage them from doing so
Mal
mj
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Posted: Monday, October 24, 2005 - 01:59 PM UTC
Mal, your MOM is just teriffic, and I hope you manage to keep it going. I know it must be taking up a lot of your modeling time. I have not entered...yet. I am mostly an armor modeller, but I like to do planes from time to time. As soon as I finish one that even slightly manages to come close to what I have enjoyed so far in your MOM exhibition, I certainly will enter it. I will say that what I am seeing shown has spurred me to try even harder to hone my "wingy-thing" skills.

As far as voting, I can't tell you who won what. I vote every month, but don't even look at the names until I have decided which planes I will vote for. And once I do vote, I couldn't tell you who won, when...the advantages of old age, I guess. While the modeling is serious, I approach the MOM "contest" as fun. A chance to see some great models, and give some people a "pat-on-the-back" from fellow Armorama members.

Once again, Mal, great job, and thank you very much for taking on the effort. I look forward to it every month.

Cheers,
Mike

Holdfast
Staff MemberPresident
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#056
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Posted: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 - 08:48 AM UTC
Cheers Mike, I appreciate it. Why not post some pics of your aircraft in the forum? I'm should you would have nothing to fear in the MOM either
Mal
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