I have a -for me at least- big pile of aircraft to be built waiting in my closet, so I went through them, and came up with a bunch of questions about aftermarket parts. I looked into reviews, etc online but I'd like to hear some opinions from people with more experience -I'm a gradstudent with very limited budget, so I can't go out there and spend $20 for a PE accessory without thinking it over reeeal hard...
So the question is: should an average builder (that's me) invest into detailing in specific cases, or even without these a decent modell can be built?

Monogram 1/48 Ju-87: a simple kit -I just bought it because it was $2 and I always wanted a Stuka in Hungarian camo. Should I bother getting aftermaket PE, resin, or just play around scratchbuilding and save my money on "worthier" kits? (Sorry, it's just an ironic wording, by no means do I indicate that it's not worth bothering with it.)

AM Avenger 1/48: it perfect kit: do I need anything else? Is it worth to buy canopy masks? (Never done "birdcage" before, and never used aftermarket masks before.) Does it benefit from a vacuform canopy? (Obviously aftermarket masks are out of the question then.)

AM Il-2: same...

AM B-25B: same here. Also: how do you open up the fuselage? (I saw some "cutout" kits, I'd like to try it. Maybe first I should get a kit that someone started and left unfinished to experiment on a cheap alternative...)

Monogram Hind 1/48: I'd like to buy masks for it (I need to repaint it, and last time it took me a week to finish masking... it's been sitting on my desk for over a year -I can't make myself redoing it.) Would the Eduard masks fit? (They are made for the Revell and Trumpeter kits).

MRC AH-1T+ supercobra: I have the Verlinden interior, and the Eduard exterior and armament PE looks fantastic -should I save up 40 bucks for them?

MRC UH-1C: I already finished the interior (the Eduard PE would have been nice), but does it need the exterior and armament PE?

Thank you

Hi Andras!

I think a decent model can be built Out Of the Box without additional PE or resin parts. These "only" make a minor difference at the end. A nice model build OOB with a nice paintjob will look better than a poorly build model enhanced with PE and resin detail parts.
BUT... a nicely build model with additional PE and resin detail parts can be made into a real masterpiece! Some builders actually can't build a model without additional aftermarket parts to give their models that little "something".
But in the end, you have to decide if all this is necessary or not. It is not a need after all!
My advice would be to practice first on kits build OOB, then to concentrate on a clean build and a clean paintjob. Once you have reached your limits, build a kit with PE parts already included (Eduard have nice ones called "Profipack") to see if they really add something more. If you think it's the case, then you will be ready for the jump!
In the list of kits you mentionned, I don't think the Accurate Miniature ones really need additional AM parts. but that's only a personnal opinion!

Jean-Luc

Hi,

Thanks for the promt answer. The thing is, I know my limitations -and I try to learn something new with each model built. (For some reason I "deviated" towards AFVs in the last year, but I'll come full circle to my beloved airplanes.) Hopefully the "build a nice, seamless airplane" stage was passed a few years ago. I'm pretty confident I can now build a decent model. (The project that scares me most is the "cutaway" B-25B.)
Anyway, what I really need is some word on those specific aftermarket stuff, that can only come from someone who actually seen them, had some experience working with them, and can't be acquired by reading a review. Since I have these kits, and I'd like to make most of them, spending the least amount of cash in the process. What can be improved, what should be improved -that's the question.
(Example: choosing PE set for my initial Tiger would easy by reading reviews: Lionroar gives you zillion tiny pieces that transform the kit's tinyest details into individual masterpieces -clearly out of my leauge. Hence I would choose Eduard. But I have no idea if the mask for a Revell Hind would fit the canopy of my Monogram kit. It might -it might not, so I ask around.)

Thanks again,

andras


(Just for fun I put every aftermarket stuf I though might be useful -wheelmasks and other "babystuff" was left out- for these kits in the basket at greatmodels.com. It came out $500 plus shipping. That's when I sat down and started this tread.)


ps: I really like your hopepage.

Hi Andras

I understand your dilemma and something I'm trying to make clear in reviews of a/m sets is who they're suitable for.

I think my Golden Rule is - DON'T by any a/m sets unless you're able to make the most of them. Sounds simple, but we're all human and get swept up in the "must have game". But a/m sets are just like kits - if you buy something beyond your ability to use/build you're:

1. Wasting your money, and
2. Bound to end up frustrated and disappointed.

Picking up on what Jean-Luc's already written, Eduard have actually done away with the Basic vs. Profi-Pack approach for their latest releases. Instead, they include all the options (i.e. full photo-etched accessories) with every kit. It's up to the builder to choose what's best for him or her. The extras are there if you choose to use them (to whatever degree), but the kit's perfectly buildable without.

Going back to your mention of classics like the Monogram Ju 87 - you want to be sure any a/m set will actually fit it. Therein lies a problem - as I highlighted in my review of Eduard's detail set for the Trumpeter P-40 - detail sets are designed to fit specific kits and there can be a degree of compromise of compatability vs. accuracy. At the end of the day "caveat emptor" is as true today as 2,000 years ago...

All the best

Rowan

Hi again

In this case, it probably will - because Revell / Monogram are usually one and the same thing these days. There are exceptions going back to their history as separate companies, but you should be perfectly safe with the Hind.

All the best

Rowan

Thanks for the answer. My concern is not about my ability; I did screw up a B-17 interior about 6 years ago, but since then I learned to confidently build up most of the PE sets I bought so far. (OK, the 1/35 Death's Head insignia from Dragon did make me sweat.) I'm not a professional builder, but have a good grasp on the trade. But I need advice on things from more experienced builders.
My problem is the price vs worth dilemma. Is it worth to by the Verlinden superdetail for the Avenger? Probably not. But PE flaps, maybe? Who knows, I've never tried them, and I thought I ask before I buy them. (I will fold up the wings anyway.) The surface of the UH-1C is pretty nice. After replacing the rivets I sanded away it might look great without aftermarket. Same with the armament. But then again: maybe it gives something really-really extra making it worth to buy it. Would it worth buying the Verlinden set for the B-25? It certainly looks great, but the AM kit is so nice, I don't know if it would show at all... (Don't forget, I'd like to open up the fuselage, so I'll have to replace a lot of wires and stuff.) How about the Il-2? Does the Eudard PE for the bomb-bay give so much extra so that it's worth buying it, or after spending 20 bucks it would look not much different from the original? If I use the Verlinden set for the AH-1, can I afford to leave rest of the helicopter out? Usually if only one thing is detailed on a model, it really stands out like a sore thumb -and I already know I'll have to scratchbuild the engine... So this is my dilemma.

Hi again

You're getting into "how long is a piece of string" territory. Eventually, only you can decide whether an a/m set offers details you couldn't manage yourself.

But, taking your example of the Accurate Miniatures' B-25, Eduard's cockpit set provides much nicer seats (the originals aren't anywhere near the overall standard of the kit) and a better instrument panel. But how much of an improvement is always subjective.

If you want my opinion, the only valid guidelines in modelling are what we set for ourselves. All that truly matters is that we build the kits we want, in manner in which we choose. Other peoples' opinions are secondary to our own enjoyment and the crucial thing is that modelling should always remain just that - enjoyable.

All the best

Rowan

I guess you're right, and I'm on a mission to nowhere. It just seemed a good idea to aks opinions about those kits.,, Thanks anyway.

Hello Andras

Just some remarks to add to Rowans comments. Think twice what you need and which manufacturer will give you the appropriate parts. I would stay away from the Verlinden sets as they require a bunch of references because the instructions are a joke. If you like Mixed Media aftermarket sets I would recomment:

Aires instrctions are better that Verlinden and somtimes you'll have to severly thin the model and resin parts but the detail is outstanding

CMK good instructions (including colour hints), good fit the early sets had some quality issues

Voyager nice, inexpensive chinese sets for armour (brass and photo etch)

Legend some very interesting sets from Korea

Verlinden some nice sets you can't get anywhere else but fit can be poor, instructions almost useless, photo etch is not up to modern standards

Resin

Neomega outstanding sets but no (!!!!) instructions

Blackbox I have never used that but I have read many good reviews -- mainly modern jets

Cutting Edge way overpriced but can be useful. check before you buy ... there are many reviews online (Armorama, Hyperscale, Modelling Madness, Aircraft Ressource Center, ... just to name a few )

Quickboost Aires offspring really easy updates and nice prices (at least here in Europe..)

Griffon another Czech company with some nice sets and a superb casting quality

Photo etch ... always check if the plastic parts do look better

Eduard I think market leader. A set (or more) for almost everything. Early sets had fit issues ... sometimes a little overengineered and more parts than usable

ABER Armour market leader ... most sets are overengineered and contain more parts than usable (some can use a whole set, I know I can't .. it is just insane to model working jerry can openers)

Hauler very nice sets from CZ, for me the best you can get for 1/48 armor (other scales also available)

Part nice sets from Poland .. especially the sets for WW 1 aircraft are praised

Extratech nice little sets from CZ sometimes a little overpriced for what you get

I bet I forgot some, check the sites of the companies for pictures (Links can be found here or if I may be so blatant: check the links section of my site http://www.ipmsdeutschland.de/IPMSlinks.html or Tony Mattelianos Scale Model Index )

Edit: One more general note: on many kits a eduard zoom set or just seat belts will be enough ... on modern jets I would buy a bang seat because the resin seats mostly look a lot better than the plastic tries. Everything else is just up to your taste. For instance see the new PZL P.23 Karas set by Eduard (Review by Rowan) and the Part set that Marek advertised in that thread. ....

I once bought 3 CMK sets for my Hs 129 sawed off all the necassary parts and then lost interest because of the modelling ROI (return on investment) which is time put in to achived result .... it is still in the box half finished

cheers

Steffen

You can also look at it from another viewpoint, certainly when budget is a major consideration.

Why would you buy a poor quality kit and then spend a fortune on aftermarket stuff when far better kits are available? By doing so you make it "unnecessary" for the mainstream manufacturers to continue upgrading their models (the crap is sold anyway).

Further, a cheap kit in combination with aftermarket stuff is almost always more expensive than a decent quality original box.

My view is that I, by definition, search for the best available kit of the model that I want to build.

Aftermarket stuff is only considered when it really adds value and not as a replacement of poorly detailed parts of the original box (heck, I don't buy poor originals).

With real added value I mean e.g. an aftermarket set making a pave low version of the Revell CH-53.