Early Aviation
Discuss World War I and the early years of aviation thru 1934.
Dioramas pt.2 "Albatros D.Va"
dolly15
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Posted: Sunday, July 13, 2008 - 04:03 AM UTC
dolly15
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Posted: Sunday, July 13, 2008 - 05:19 AM UTC
dolly15
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Posted: Sunday, July 13, 2008 - 05:31 AM UTC
Interesting question
In the pic above of an Albatros accident victim,I find it quite strange that the fabric would burn off of the wings and not set fire to the wood ribs.
Would it be because the fabric burned off so fast that the wood didn't have chance to be ignited.
Was the wood subjected to a flame retardant or preservative of some kind that did not so easily ignite as dope and linen?
This could be something that I could incorporate into my wreck that would allow me to show some of the structure even if it was a little fire damaged.
Did they have some kind of fire fighting equipment that they may have used to spray the aircraft during the initial stages of the fire which would account for the wings not burning?
JackFlash
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Posted: Sunday, July 13, 2008 - 08:23 AM UTC
While the wood will char and in some cases at the narrowest point burn totally, the fabric will burn much quicker. Firefighting equipment would be water, sand, axes and hack saws.

Other items might be, bandage packages, broken plasma bottles, morphin syringes.

In the "Bone Pile" of course you will have broken sections of aircraft structure, fuel lines, cut lap and shoulder harness', Bent and broken engine parts discarded mascots, broken goggles, bent wire wheels, flat tires, etc.
dolly15
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Posted: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 - 04:37 AM UTC
A modeling bud wrote:

John: The reason that the fabric burned so fast was that it was finished with a celulosenitrate dope that flashed off very quickly. I know from personal experience just how quickly these old finishes are consumed when the Tiger Moth that I was flying caught fire after an accident.

The wood structures were finished with a varnish that contained a high percentage of lindseed oil used to help preserve the wood.

I've been following your build and enjoying every bit of it. Keep[ up the good work

Barney
dolly15
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Posted: Thursday, July 17, 2008 - 08:37 AM UTC
Dirt is dirt,right? Wrong!
It is amazing just how many varieties of dirt that I have found just in my backyard.Different textures ,colors etc... I have found that fine crushed gravel that has mixed with topsoil about some of the best for 1/16th scale work.This happened naturally in my case as the crushed gravel has been there awhile and naturally mixed with the dirt.You could use fresh fine crushed gravel sifted through an ordinary metal household sieve and then mixed with a sandy soil to achieve about the same thing.The idea is to get a natural looking rock-soil mix that you would find in nature in 1/16th scale.For other scales you would need to use a finer sieve or a courser type sand to simulate small stones an pebbles.
I have collected a few different varieties of soil and two types of sand both sieved and non sieved.
I heat it up in my microwave to kill any lingering critters (while my wife is out of course)about 12 mins on high should do.I tried the BBQ a few times but it tends to blacken it too much.You will just have to experiment with the soil and sand in your area.Also keep in mind the environment that you are trying to represent,desert,tropical etc....
dolly15
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Posted: Friday, July 18, 2008 - 07:34 AM UTC
dolly15
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Posted: Friday, July 18, 2008 - 07:38 AM UTC
Here's what I mean!
I didn't make up a large enough batch in the beginning so I obtained two samples from slightly different areas of my backyard.As you can see one is slightly courser than the other and they are different colors.This is of no real concern to me as a bit of blending and all the turf to follow will easily cover this.
JackFlash
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Posted: Friday, July 18, 2008 - 07:45 AM UTC
Impressive John.
dolly15
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Posted: Friday, July 18, 2008 - 07:47 AM UTC
Merlin
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Posted: Friday, July 18, 2008 - 09:40 AM UTC
Hi John

Incredible work! Your builds are a constant source of inspiration.

Sorry if it's a rather simplistic question, but do you have any advice on obtaining realistic "in-scale" grass and foliage colours? The reason I ask is that all too many of the railway diorama products which I've looked at are a totally OTT "radioactive" green that looks very toy-like when used.

Once it's finished, if you can bear to batter this epic build down into an article that could fit into a Feature, we really should get it onto the Front-page! Aeroscale attracts a lot of visitors who never delve into the Forum, so this (along with many other treasures) is lost on a potentially huge extra audience.

All the best

Rowan
JackFlash
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Posted: Friday, July 18, 2008 - 09:54 AM UTC
Pardon me for chiming in here. Both John and I use the Woodland Scenics turfs in blends. Medium green with field grass or dark green with meiuum green. Weeds with sweet grass. Many variations are possible.

dolly15
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Posted: Saturday, July 19, 2008 - 03:42 AM UTC
Hi Rowan! Stephen is right,Woodlands offers excellent products and instructions including downloadable videos on their comprehensive website.My experience with this is very limited as I am using only some of their products to create mostly grassy/muddy areas found around early airfields.The RR guys are experts at this and some are what I would call 3D artists.
I also use things from nature rocks,twigs,soil and even some of my dogs hair!! Anything from natural sources should be sterilized for possible critters though.
When all of my present commitments are finished I plan to write an on-line condensed version of my diorama experiences. Cheers!
dolly15
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Posted: Saturday, July 19, 2008 - 04:48 AM UTC
dolly15
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Posted: Saturday, July 19, 2008 - 04:51 AM UTC
Most of this is Woodland products mixed with natural stuff and is from the Jenny diorama.
Merlin
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Posted: Saturday, July 19, 2008 - 05:03 AM UTC
Thanks Stephen and John

We do get Woodland Scenics products over here - I've got a few items and they definitely do seem better than a lot of the stuf available in the UK. I didn't realise they had downloadable videos - I'll definitely check them out, because that could be a huge help for anyone like me who has little experience making bases.

All the best

Rowan
dolly15
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Posted: Monday, July 21, 2008 - 10:52 AM UTC
dolly15
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Posted: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - 10:01 AM UTC
Another pic
JackFlash
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Posted: Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - 10:18 AM UTC
In the last shot it looks like a field of lilacs! I like it.
dolly15
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Posted: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 01:41 AM UTC

Quoted Text

In the last shot it looks like a field of lilacs! I like it.


Yeah it depends a lot on the lighting I find,indoors it looks completely different.Thank you Stephen so much for the goods received.I owe you one! Cheers.John..
dolly15
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Posted: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 03:03 AM UTC
Lighting! I wish I knew...
Unfortunately at this point I have no idea where these dioramas are to be displayed in the museum.Why do I say unfortunately? because the type of lighting will ultimately make a huge difference.The museum is in re-design mode right now and I have been told that there is a good possibility that at least one will be going in a high traffic area of the museum(whatever that means)
Anyone who has been to a aviation museum will know just how greatly lighting conditions can vary.Natural VS artificial light, which also can vary from soft to hard ,cool to warm etc....If I knew at this point I could adjust my colors accordingly.
The above pictures' slightly mauve color is actually my cameras doing not the lighting which of course is another variable.
I remember when I was involved with decorative bird carving and painting some of the guys would bring their own lighting to the competition Others would carve and paint their birds under lighting that gave them the most dramatic shadows and colors and bring the exact same lighting to the exhibition hall.(most of these large halls were lit like a school gym)Proper lighting truly makes all the difference especially for 3D art.
dolly15
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Posted: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 05:35 AM UTC
dolly15
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Posted: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 05:41 AM UTC
Not an airplane.....
but a great example of what a single low wattage bulb can do for a 3D hi-relief sculpture.I did this piece as a commission about 20 years ago.It is made from a single panel of basswood and carved with chisels.If I remember correctly it is about 30X40 inches.
dolly15
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Posted: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 12:12 PM UTC
dolly15
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Posted: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 12:15 PM UTC
Here is the same panel with the pic taken indoors.I have added some course turf of three different colors,light green,burnt grass and earth and re-soaked the panel with the 75% water and 25% glue mix.I have noticed that with each successive soaking of glue the dirt darkens again slightly.