Hey guys,
Thanks to Jean-Luc and Jessica for supporting our Spitfire project by this thread. Amazing job you guys!
Just wanted to put to your attention, that we've released first Spitfire bonus, which you can download for free from our websites.
You can download it here:
Blueprint of our Spitfire Mk.IXc late version in hi-res PDF & TIF
World War II
Discuss WWII and the era directly before and after the war from 1935-1949.
Discuss WWII and the era directly before and after the war from 1935-1949.
Hosted by Rowan Baylis
FEATURE
Preview: Eduard's Spitfire IX
seby_cz
Joined: January 22, 2007
KitMaker: 18 posts
AeroScale: 14 posts
KitMaker: 18 posts
AeroScale: 14 posts
Posted: Friday, March 01, 2013 - 11:34 AM UTC
Jessie_C
Joined: September 03, 2009
KitMaker: 6,965 posts
AeroScale: 6,247 posts
Posted: Friday, March 01, 2013 - 02:00 PM UTC
Well we certainly got people talking about the kit! There's a lot of anticipation hereabouts 
TedMamere
Joined: May 15, 2005
KitMaker: 5,653 posts
AeroScale: 4,347 posts
Posted: Friday, March 01, 2013 - 08:56 PM UTC
Hi all,
I have downloaded the blueprints (nice from Eduard) and here is the part about the wheel wells...
Not only is the opening the right shape, but it seems as if the guys at Eduard have also considered the oblique of the wells. I've checked the Airfix, Ocidental/Italeri, ICM and Hasegawa/Revell kits and they are all simplified (straight) in that area. 1 - 0 for Eduard already and if you take the superb surface finish of the new kit in account it is already 2 - 0 in my mind.
Jean-Luc
I have downloaded the blueprints (nice from Eduard) and here is the part about the wheel wells...
Not only is the opening the right shape, but it seems as if the guys at Eduard have also considered the oblique of the wells. I've checked the Airfix, Ocidental/Italeri, ICM and Hasegawa/Revell kits and they are all simplified (straight) in that area. 1 - 0 for Eduard already and if you take the superb surface finish of the new kit in account it is already 2 - 0 in my mind.
Jean-Luc
SunburntPenguin
Joined: March 15, 2011
KitMaker: 121 posts
AeroScale: 112 posts
Posted: Friday, March 01, 2013 - 09:42 PM UTC
Jean-Luc, thanks for the blueprint. It illustrates perfectly what Eduard have done with the wheel well.
Gaston, masking anything and leaving the mask on for ages will always lead to problems. It has nothing to do with your build pace. It's simple painting techniques. Ask anyone who has painted a house what happens if you leave the masking up too long. Not only does it get difficult to remove it will leave a nasty residue behind.
As long as Eduard branch out a bring out a Spitfire Mk VIII, I'll be buying this kit.
Gaston, masking anything and leaving the mask on for ages will always lead to problems. It has nothing to do with your build pace. It's simple painting techniques. Ask anyone who has painted a house what happens if you leave the masking up too long. Not only does it get difficult to remove it will leave a nasty residue behind.
As long as Eduard branch out a bring out a Spitfire Mk VIII, I'll be buying this kit.
Merlin
Senior Editor
#017
Joined: June 11, 2003
KitMaker: 17,582 posts
AeroScale: 12,795 posts
Posted: Friday, March 01, 2013 - 10:49 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Hey guys,
... Just wanted to put to your attention, that we've released first Spitfire bonus, which you can download for free from our websites.
You can download it here:
Blueprint of our Spitfire Mk.IXc late version in hi-res PDF & TIF
Hi Libor
Many thanks for the link. The drawings are really useful - well worth downloading.
All the best
Rowan
TheModeller
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 127 posts
AeroScale: 61 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 02, 2013 - 12:40 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Well we certainly got people talking about the kit! There's a lot of anticipation hereabouts
Its the first Eduard kit to interest me since the Tempest was released!
Looks like its going to be well worth the wait!
Antoni
Joined: June 03, 2006
KitMaker: 574 posts
AeroScale: 573 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 02, 2013 - 07:37 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi all,
Eduard have just posted a picture especially for us on their facebook page...
One thing's for sure their sense of humor is the right shape!
Jean-Luc
Not one of you noticed what they have done!
see:
http://www.eduard.com/blog/additional-spitfire-mk-ixc-late-version-wing-modifications-spitfire-contest-3/
EdgarBrooks
Joined: June 03, 2006
KitMaker: 397 posts
AeroScale: 384 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 02, 2013 - 08:49 AM UTC
Oh, that could be a pity, and I wish they'd said something, since it's unlikely that many (if any) IXs had that cut-out before 1945, at least in Europe, and it might only have been seen in Italy.
Yes, I do know the purpose of the cut-out, and, no, I'm not entering the competition, nor am I releasing the cat from the bag, either.
Edgar
Yes, I do know the purpose of the cut-out, and, no, I'm not entering the competition, nor am I releasing the cat from the bag, either.
Edgar
Jessie_C
Joined: September 03, 2009
KitMaker: 6,965 posts
AeroScale: 6,247 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 02, 2013 - 08:57 AM UTC
At least it's easily correctable if you don't want it there.
Antoni
Joined: June 03, 2006
KitMaker: 574 posts
AeroScale: 573 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 02, 2013 - 10:42 AM UTC
It does not take many brain cells to work out where they got the shape of the wheels from - TE565.
Voila.
Voila.
lampie
#029
Joined: December 23, 2005
KitMaker: 6,249 posts
AeroScale: 3,270 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 02, 2013 - 09:27 PM UTC
[quote]
I may well be wrong, but that first colour photo looks extremely similar to one that an Australian modeller ,(Tim somebody?), posted in a set of images he'd done using his 1:72 models?
Quoted Text
Most Spitfire wartime pictures look like the above...
I was going for a stronger tonal contrast, which seemed typical of the majority of wartime photos:
The colours Tamiya offer in their range are maybe good for brand-new, but for most pictures they are way too dark with too low a contrast: In particular the gray faded much faster, giving the typical wartime look of high contrast...
But if you want your Spitfire to look like an airshow fashion victim (with heavy weathering!), be my guest... Don't worry, you'll get there, eventually...
Gaston
I may well be wrong, but that first colour photo looks extremely similar to one that an Australian modeller ,(Tim somebody?), posted in a set of images he'd done using his 1:72 models?
AussieReg
Associate Editor#007
Joined: June 09, 2009
KitMaker: 8,156 posts
AeroScale: 3,756 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 02, 2013 - 11:04 PM UTC
Tim Prosser (Tango-India-Mike), the thread is called "Flying Plastic"
spaarndammer
Joined: January 28, 2007
KitMaker: 1,945 posts
AeroScale: 388 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 03, 2013 - 03:47 AM UTC
If interpreting the reviews right, the ICM Spitfire IX is one of the best representations in 1/48 to date.
Given that the ICM kit is quite cheap (16 euros) and with this in mind, I wonder how the Eduard kit will compare to the ICM kit.
Jelger
Given that the ICM kit is quite cheap (16 euros) and with this in mind, I wonder how the Eduard kit will compare to the ICM kit.
Jelger
TheModeller
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 127 posts
AeroScale: 61 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 03, 2013 - 04:15 AM UTC
The ICM kit is the best of the 1/48th two-stage Merlin Spits currently available, it has its faults, the gear is a bit narrow and the 'high-back' fuselage is a bit too sharp along the spine aft of the cockpit, but those are not difficult to sort out with a little application. Obviously the XVI kit doesn't suffer from the pointy spine.
The real drawback for many modellers is the complexity of the engine/cowl breakdown, if you want to build it with the cowl panels closed up you will have a better time of it if you leave the engine out and trim the firewall down before fitting, its way too wide and will force the fuselage to spread resulting in lots of dihedral! the fuselage needs the firewall fitted to give it some rigidity if you leave out the engine.
Moulding quality is the other big let down, sink marks are commonplace, even in the Revell re-release of the XVI they put out recently, older ICM issues were more flash than kit parts and short-shots also caused problems, newer boxings are much better but the sink-marks never go away so be prepared for some filling.
The Butcher of Quebec has been known to make lots of noises about other errors with the ICM kit, they are largely unfounded nonsense if you know Spits, its far from a perfect kit but with some effort, experience and a few upgrades from the Ultracast resin line its the best thats currently available.
I've built quite a few and still have more in the stash, I think they'll all be sold on once the Eduard kit comes around!
The real drawback for many modellers is the complexity of the engine/cowl breakdown, if you want to build it with the cowl panels closed up you will have a better time of it if you leave the engine out and trim the firewall down before fitting, its way too wide and will force the fuselage to spread resulting in lots of dihedral! the fuselage needs the firewall fitted to give it some rigidity if you leave out the engine.
Moulding quality is the other big let down, sink marks are commonplace, even in the Revell re-release of the XVI they put out recently, older ICM issues were more flash than kit parts and short-shots also caused problems, newer boxings are much better but the sink-marks never go away so be prepared for some filling.
The Butcher of Quebec has been known to make lots of noises about other errors with the ICM kit, they are largely unfounded nonsense if you know Spits, its far from a perfect kit but with some effort, experience and a few upgrades from the Ultracast resin line its the best thats currently available.
I've built quite a few and still have more in the stash, I think they'll all be sold on once the Eduard kit comes around!
EdgarBrooks
Joined: June 03, 2006
KitMaker: 397 posts
AeroScale: 384 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 03, 2013 - 04:51 AM UTC
One other, fairly compelling, reason to ditch the ICM engine, is that it isn't a two-stage 60-series Merlin; we suspect that they looked at one of the BBMF's aircraft, which has a single-stage 50-series. With no engine in their kit, Eduard have neatly avoided that pitfall.
Edgar
Edgar
Merlin
Senior Editor#017
Joined: June 11, 2003
KitMaker: 17,582 posts
AeroScale: 12,795 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 03, 2013 - 05:29 AM UTC
Hi there
Eduard will be hosting a live web-chat about the kit this evening:
" Live IRC Chat With Eduard's CEO Vladimir Sulc Tonight!
Hello Rowan,
We're having our first live-chat session this evening and we would be happy if you could join us!
You can join the IRC live-chat room from 20:00 of Prague time, GMT+1, on April 3rd - this Sunday.
(The live chat session with Vladimir Sulc begins in 5 hour from the moment of receiving this email.)
Vladimir will be prepared to answer all your questions related to our upcoming Spitfire Mk.IXc late version 1/48.
Links to chat channels will be posted on our Facebook and we will also send it to you by email. We're looking forward to meeting you live tonight!
(FYI - The chat session will take around one hour.)
Eduard Team"
All the best
Rowan
Eduard will be hosting a live web-chat about the kit this evening:
" Live IRC Chat With Eduard's CEO Vladimir Sulc Tonight!
Hello Rowan,
We're having our first live-chat session this evening and we would be happy if you could join us!
You can join the IRC live-chat room from 20:00 of Prague time, GMT+1, on April 3rd - this Sunday.
(The live chat session with Vladimir Sulc begins in 5 hour from the moment of receiving this email.)
Vladimir will be prepared to answer all your questions related to our upcoming Spitfire Mk.IXc late version 1/48.
Links to chat channels will be posted on our Facebook and we will also send it to you by email. We're looking forward to meeting you live tonight!
(FYI - The chat session will take around one hour.)
Eduard Team"
All the best
Rowan
TheModeller
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 127 posts
AeroScale: 61 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 03, 2013 - 05:40 AM UTC
Quoted Text
One other, fairly compelling, reason to ditch the ICM engine, is that it isn't a two-stage 60-series Merlin; we suspect that they looked at one of the BBMF's aircraft, which has a single-stage 50-series. With no engine in their kit, Eduard have neatly avoided that pitfall.
Edgar
Its also woefully underscaled, best pitched into file-13 from the outset really, my personal taste is for a Spit all closed up, open cowls and things like that just spoil the lines of the airframe.
Merlin
Senior Editor#017
Joined: June 11, 2003
KitMaker: 17,582 posts
AeroScale: 12,795 posts
Posted: Monday, March 04, 2013 - 10:10 AM UTC
Hi again
I was out last night, so I missed Eduard's on-line discussion of the kit. Did anyone get a chance to follow it or join in - and, if so, is there any fresh news to report?
All the best
Rowan
I was out last night, so I missed Eduard's on-line discussion of the kit. Did anyone get a chance to follow it or join in - and, if so, is there any fresh news to report?
All the best
Rowan
GastonMarty
Joined: April 19, 2008
KitMaker: 595 posts
AeroScale: 507 posts
Posted: Monday, March 04, 2013 - 07:03 PM UTC
[quote]
No: This first image below is part of what you are talking about: The model is by Tim Prosser, obviously a uniquely talented modeller, and it did indeed fool me completely (the picture of the Mk V I posted in the other post is probably the real thing however):
Here is the Mk V I posted previously:
As for the ICM wings, they do have their wheel wells too close together, including the gear leg root hinges, by about six scale inches (or thereabouts compared to most other kits), giving a "knocked knee" narrow-track effect, and this is well established by those who know these Spitfire kits well (not my discovery at all).
You can see how big the difference is compared to the Hasegawa Mk IX on the left:
Hasegawa's guns do appear to be too far apart vs pictures, ICM or Airfix...
I would add that these ICM wings, like Hasegawa's Mk IX wings, are also around 1 to 1.5 mm short in chord at the trailing edge (increasing towards the root)compared to the those of the Airfix Mk XII (Airfix Mk XII wings do agree very well with pictures in plan view): I find that this particular discrepancy is really not noticeable, despite the large figure, because large curves are more visually forgiving.
The wheel well/gear spacing of the ICM wings is a whole other story, as is the too sharp fuselage spine...
Gaston
Quoted Text
Quoted Text
Most Spitfire wartime pictures look like the above...
I was going for a stronger tonal contrast, which seemed typical of the majority of wartime photos:
The colours Tamiya offer in their range are maybe good for brand-new, but for most pictures they are way too dark with too low a contrast: In particular the gray faded much faster, giving the typical wartime look of high contrast...
But if you want your Spitfire to look like an airshow fashion victim (with heavy weathering!), be my guest... Don't worry, you'll get there, eventually...
Gaston
I may well be wrong, but that first colour photo looks extremely similar to one that an Australian modeller ,(Tim somebody?), posted in a set of images he'd done using his 1:72 models?
No: This first image below is part of what you are talking about: The model is by Tim Prosser, obviously a uniquely talented modeller, and it did indeed fool me completely (the picture of the Mk V I posted in the other post is probably the real thing however):
Here is the Mk V I posted previously:
As for the ICM wings, they do have their wheel wells too close together, including the gear leg root hinges, by about six scale inches (or thereabouts compared to most other kits), giving a "knocked knee" narrow-track effect, and this is well established by those who know these Spitfire kits well (not my discovery at all).
You can see how big the difference is compared to the Hasegawa Mk IX on the left:
Hasegawa's guns do appear to be too far apart vs pictures, ICM or Airfix...
I would add that these ICM wings, like Hasegawa's Mk IX wings, are also around 1 to 1.5 mm short in chord at the trailing edge (increasing towards the root)compared to the those of the Airfix Mk XII (Airfix Mk XII wings do agree very well with pictures in plan view): I find that this particular discrepancy is really not noticeable, despite the large figure, because large curves are more visually forgiving.
The wheel well/gear spacing of the ICM wings is a whole other story, as is the too sharp fuselage spine...
Gaston
TedMamere
Joined: May 15, 2005
KitMaker: 5,653 posts
AeroScale: 4,347 posts
Posted: Monday, March 04, 2013 - 07:53 PM UTC
Hi Rowan,
I have participated to the discussions and I didn't copied it sadly...
But it was nice to chat with M. Sulc and M. Havranek and they allowed the participants to ask questions non related to the Spitfire as well. So in the end it was a little bit confusing. I regret not to have copied the complete list of Spitfire variants and Brassin items they have planned to release.
Jean-Luc
Quoted Text
I was out last night, so I missed Eduard's on-line discussion of the kit. Did anyone get a chance to follow it or join in - and, if so, is there any fresh news to report?
I have participated to the discussions and I didn't copied it sadly...
But it was nice to chat with M. Sulc and M. Havranek and they allowed the participants to ask questions non related to the Spitfire as well. So in the end it was a little bit confusing. I regret not to have copied the complete list of Spitfire variants and Brassin items they have planned to release.
Jean-Luc
Merlin
Senior Editor#017
Joined: June 11, 2003
KitMaker: 17,582 posts
AeroScale: 12,795 posts
Posted: Monday, March 04, 2013 - 08:56 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi Rowan,
I have participated to the discussions and I didn't copied it sadly...
Jean-Luc
Hi Jean-Luc
Too bad. Hopefully there's an "early" u/c version planned though?
All the best
Rowan
TheModeller
Joined: March 01, 2010
KitMaker: 127 posts
AeroScale: 61 posts
Posted: Monday, March 04, 2013 - 11:49 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I would add that these ICM wings, like Hasegawa's Mk IX wings, are also around 1 to 1.5 mm short in chord at the trailing edge (increasing towards the root)compared to the those of the Airfix Mk XII (Airfix Mk XII wings do agree very well with pictures in plan view): I find that this particular discrepancy is really not noticeable, despite the large figure, because large curves are more visually forgiving.
Never seen the point of trying to establish a kits accuracy by comparing it to another kit, but each to thier own I guess!
TedMamere
Joined: May 15, 2005
KitMaker: 5,653 posts
AeroScale: 4,347 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 - 12:09 AM UTC
Hi Rowan,
Libor from Eduard (Thanks again!) has posted the content of the live chat here...
- Chat session log from 3rd March 2013
Enjoy...
Jean-Luc
Quoted Text
Too bad.
Libor from Eduard (Thanks again!) has posted the content of the live chat here...
- Chat session log from 3rd March 2013
Enjoy...
Jean-Luc
Merlin
Senior Editor#017
Joined: June 11, 2003
KitMaker: 17,582 posts
AeroScale: 12,795 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 05, 2013 - 10:06 PM UTC
Cheers Jean-Luc
Nice to see my question cropped up near the beginning of the session.
All the best
Rowan
Nice to see my question cropped up near the beginning of the session.
All the best
Rowan
GastonMarty
Joined: April 19, 2008
KitMaker: 595 posts
AeroScale: 507 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 16, 2013 - 11:53 AM UTC
Quoted Text
It does not take many brain cells to work out where they got the shape of the wheels from - TE565.
Voila.
Why make comparisons at slanted angles, when straight-on can be found?
This is a rough replication of this shape on the Eduard wheel well: I would consider good enough to use as a reference to correct the Eduard kit (maybe a little too much oval, and preferrably sized to match the kit wheel rather than just to match my drawing): It is doeable but a bit harder than I expected. The Eduard lit is definitely off in this area, no matter what they claim (and I still think highly of it!):
Again, the ICM "knock-knee" is also vs real pictures, but pointed out by others.
The 1.5 mm longer chord of the Airfix Mk XII (vs Hasegawa and ICM) is a less certain issue, but I lean (slightly) towards it being correct after comparing to pictures, despite the position of the trailing edge root on the Airfix Mk XII being slightly too far back by this same amount compared to the pilot's seat rear bulkhead: I took pictures of my museum's Mk IX, and there is no doubt Airfix were right to move the PR XIX's trailing edge slightly forward.
That being said, the Airfix Mk XII's trailing edge position is nowhere near as bad as that of the Special Hobby and Tamiya Spitfires, which put it in the middle of the perspex...
As for the wing chord, I will build two Spits, so at least one will be closer!
Gaston
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