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"Bloody April Campaign 1917" Official thread
Lucky13
Joined: June 01, 2006
KitMaker: 1,707 posts
AeroScale: 1,119 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 - 01:18 PM UTC
Anyone seen my 25 year old Laphroaig??
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 - 01:38 PM UTC
Hmmm a missing cask of single malt? Ursula!!!!!
jRatz
Joined: March 06, 2004
KitMaker: 1,171 posts
AeroScale: 151 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 06:58 AM UTC
OK, it's January ...
I'm still hung up over this campaign. The published criteria is ""Bloody April 1917" Build an history correct - ace's mount from Allied or Central Powers and his victim. Describing in the best detail you can the fateful combat."
Is this strict, or can it be an ace and another aircraft and maybe the ace comes out 2nd best. I'm going thru "Bloody April..Black Sept.." and have found a couple combats where an ace in a D.III came out on the short end of the combat with an FE.2 or a BE.2 .... I've got a couple more Brit/Ger refs due in, doing my own combat cross-checking.
Unfortunately none of these folks are big names and so individual aircraft markings are usually unknown -- although I'm at least getting serial numbers.
Is that OK (to loosen this up a bit) ?
When do we really kick this thing off ?
Stephen, do you need an assistant ?
PS: I'm not in any hurry to start -- I'm behind & bench is full ... made fuller by arrival of the Roden 1/32 SE5a ...
John
I'm still hung up over this campaign. The published criteria is ""Bloody April 1917" Build an history correct - ace's mount from Allied or Central Powers and his victim. Describing in the best detail you can the fateful combat."
Is this strict, or can it be an ace and another aircraft and maybe the ace comes out 2nd best. I'm going thru "Bloody April..Black Sept.." and have found a couple combats where an ace in a D.III came out on the short end of the combat with an FE.2 or a BE.2 .... I've got a couple more Brit/Ger refs due in, doing my own combat cross-checking.
Unfortunately none of these folks are big names and so individual aircraft markings are usually unknown -- although I'm at least getting serial numbers.
Is that OK (to loosen this up a bit) ?
When do we really kick this thing off ?
Stephen, do you need an assistant ?
PS: I'm not in any hurry to start -- I'm behind & bench is full ... made fuller by arrival of the Roden 1/32 SE5a ...
John
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 07:06 PM UTC
Quoted Text
OK, it's January ...
I'm still hung up over this campaign. The published criteria is ""Bloody April 1917" Build an history correct - ace's mount from Allied or Central Powers and his victim. Describing in the best detail you can the fateful combat."
Is this strict, or can it be an ace and another aircraft and maybe the ace comes out 2nd best. I'm going thru "Bloody April..Black Sept.." and have found a couple combats where an ace in a D.III came out on the short end of the combat with an FE.2 or a BE.2 .... I've got a couple more Brit/Ger refs due in, doing my own combat cross-checking.
Unfortunately none of these folks are big names and so individual aircraft markings are usually unknown -- although I'm at least getting serial numbers.
Is that OK (to loosen this up a bit) ?
When do we really kick this thing off ?
Stephen, do you need an assistant ?
PS: I'm not in any hurry to start -- I'm behind & bench is full ... made fuller by arrival of the Roden 1/32 SE5a ...
John
Hey John! I am just awaiting clearance and the Campaign to be posted. We wanted it start Jan 3.
"Bloody April 1917" Build an history correct - ace's mount from Allied or Central Powers and his victim. Describing in the best detail you can the fateful combat.
"...let me say that we have not been too strict in its application. The Ace could have become and Ace later on. (Using the term "Ace" in the venacular has different standards for each combatant nation. Five victories is typical for the allies. lets say 5 victories minimum. Yes the combat has to have taken place somewhere between April 1 - 30, 1917. Though it can be any two combatants that actually meet during that time period and yes that would entail two builds. But To make it easy. If you already have one model in hand we could allow that you simply build its opposite..."
Essentially one of the combatants has to have become an "ace" at some point in their career but the combat has to have taken place During the month of April 1917. If the "ace" came out second best that not really a problem.
John. if this thing gets too big I may need some help. As it is we have about 40 that are interested. Let me get back to you on that.
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 07:14 PM UTC
By the way here is the image of the proposed ribbon.
Lucky13
Joined: June 01, 2006
KitMaker: 1,707 posts
AeroScale: 1,119 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 08:06 PM UTC
Class work O' Enlighted One!
I'm in btw Sir! With Bruno Loerzer who became an ace 30 of April 1917 at 19:30 over Bellengise.
Don't know what the enemy aicraft was though, any ideas what to do?
I'm in btw Sir! With Bruno Loerzer who became an ace 30 of April 1917 at 19:30 over Bellengise.
Don't know what the enemy aicraft was though, any ideas what to do?
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 08:30 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Class work O' Enlighted One!
I'm in btw Sir! With Bruno Loerzer who became an ace 30 of April 1917 at 19:30 over Bellengise. Don't know what the enemy aicraft was though, any ideas what to do?
30 Apr 1917 Oblt. B. Loerzer, personal victory #5 was over a Sopwith Pup #A.6145, Naval 3, flown by F/S/Lt. J.J. Malone, KIA, 19.30 Ramicourt, Bourlon.
Oblt. B. Loerzer was probably flying an Albatros D.III. Dan San may have a drawing of this machine.
Lucky13
Joined: June 01, 2006
KitMaker: 1,707 posts
AeroScale: 1,119 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 - 08:44 PM UTC
That's awesome Stephen, thanks!
Just a question of finding a 1/48 Sopwith Pup then....
Just a question of finding a 1/48 Sopwith Pup then....
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 04, 2007 - 03:06 AM UTC
I did have one for sale on my website but it was pic ked up in Nov.06. Evil-bay might be another choice. I do wish Eduard would punch another 1/48 Sop. Pup out.
Dan-San
Joined: January 28, 2006
KitMaker: 29 posts
AeroScale: 28 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 04, 2007 - 04:19 AM UTC
Gentlemen:
No. 55 Squadron with D.H.4 powered with Rolls-Royce engine on 6 April 1917. No.56 Squadron went into the Battle of Arras on 6 April 1917 with the 150 hp S.E.5. So these two must be added to your list.
The Luftstreitkräfte had in operations in April 1917 the following fighters: Alb. D.II, Alb.D.III, Fok.D.I, Fok.D.II, Halb. D.II, D.III, D.V. Rol.D.I, Rol.D.II.
I'll be back with a Class C list of reconnaisance aircraft.
blue skies,
Dan-San
No. 55 Squadron with D.H.4 powered with Rolls-Royce engine on 6 April 1917. No.56 Squadron went into the Battle of Arras on 6 April 1917 with the 150 hp S.E.5. So these two must be added to your list.
The Luftstreitkräfte had in operations in April 1917 the following fighters: Alb. D.II, Alb.D.III, Fok.D.I, Fok.D.II, Halb. D.II, D.III, D.V. Rol.D.I, Rol.D.II.
I'll be back with a Class C list of reconnaisance aircraft.
blue skies,
Dan-San
Lucky13
Joined: June 01, 2006
KitMaker: 1,707 posts
AeroScale: 1,119 posts
Posted: Friday, January 05, 2007 - 07:23 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Class work O' Enlighted One!
I'm in btw Sir! With Bruno Loerzer who became an ace 30 of April 1917 at 19:30 over Bellengise.
Don't know what the enemy aicraft was though, any ideas what to do?
What kind of markings did he have on his Albatros D. III Where they the same as on his D. V but with the "star"?
I've found some pictures that shows that, I just want to make sure by checking with those who's in the know.
Cheers fellas!
Edit: Forgot to tell yous that the pictures are of a Albatros D. III model not the real machine.
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Friday, January 05, 2007 - 10:01 PM UTC
Greetings all just a short note from Jean-Luc.
Quoted Text
"Hi all!
Below is an updated list of the Group Builds planned for 2007.
...- Bloody April 1917 - Jackflash + JRatz
The Campaign System is still "frozen" all over the KitMaker Network. I think we will have to ask StaffJim about the status of the 2007 Campaigns again. Of course, if we start late (this could take hours, days or weeks!?) we can extend the Group Build's end dates.
Jean-Luc"
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Friday, January 05, 2007 - 10:09 PM UTC
Quoted Text
"...What kind of markings did he have on his Albatros D. III Where they the same as on his D. V but with the "star"? I've found some pictures that shows that, I just want to make sure by checking with those who's in the know... Cheers fellas!
Edit: Forgot to tell yous that the pictures are of a Albatros D. III model not the real machine...
Check with Dan-San for specifics. It was typical for Jasta 26 machines to have the Black & white banded sections around their fuselages. From the Roden 1/32 kit we have this colour scheme description...
"...3. Albatros D.III, s/n unconfirmed, Lt. Bruno Loerzer, Jasta 26, Western Front, Summer 1917..."
There are further comments found in the Osprey pub. on WWI Albatros Aces.
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 03:50 PM UTC
Here is a bit of fun but the uppersurface camouflage I would question.
Lucky13
Joined: June 01, 2006
KitMaker: 1,707 posts
AeroScale: 1,119 posts
Posted: Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 03:53 PM UTC
The same model that I've seen before Stephen....raises a few 
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Sunday, January 07, 2007 - 03:58 PM UTC
As Dan San discusses in the thread on the Albatros camouflage thread it should be three colour camouflage with a repaired upper wing tip. Mauve colour didn't come into use with the Johannistahl built Alb. D.III. Their camouflage began with the three colour Venetian red brown, dk green, and Brunswick (lt. green). When the red brown was deleted from factory use after about April 1917 the colours were just dk green, and Brunswick (lt. green.)
It was in the late summer 1917 that mauve came into use with the Luftstreitkrafte. The Alb. D.V and the Alb. D.III built by OAW even some early Pfalz D.III types used Mauve and dk. green at that point.
It was in the late summer 1917 that mauve came into use with the Luftstreitkrafte. The Alb. D.V and the Alb. D.III built by OAW even some early Pfalz D.III types used Mauve and dk. green at that point.
Dan-San
Joined: January 28, 2006
KitMaker: 29 posts
AeroScale: 28 posts
Posted: Monday, January 08, 2007 - 12:53 AM UTC
Gentlemen;
In April 1917, Jasta 26 was using black and white bands on the fuselage and tailplane.
Blue skies,
Dan-San
In April 1917, Jasta 26 was using black and white bands on the fuselage and tailplane.
Blue skies,
Dan-San
Dan-San
Joined: January 28, 2006
KitMaker: 29 posts
AeroScale: 28 posts
Posted: Monday, January 08, 2007 - 01:11 AM UTC
Gentlemen:
All Albatros built machines in following serial number batch had their upper surfaces painted in an asymetric three color camouflage of : Dark olive green, pale whitish green and rust brown. The rudder was painted the same color as the central color on the tailplane. The trailing edge of the rudder was straight, not rounded. The under surfaces and wheel covers were painted sky blue. Fuselage were shellacked and varnished in warm yellow color, they were not stained. All Struts, cowlings and all external metal parts were painted grey, tinged green.
1. 400 Alb.D.III 1910/16 to 2309/16.
Blue skies,
Dan-San
All Albatros built machines in following serial number batch had their upper surfaces painted in an asymetric three color camouflage of : Dark olive green, pale whitish green and rust brown. The rudder was painted the same color as the central color on the tailplane. The trailing edge of the rudder was straight, not rounded. The under surfaces and wheel covers were painted sky blue. Fuselage were shellacked and varnished in warm yellow color, they were not stained. All Struts, cowlings and all external metal parts were painted grey, tinged green.
1. 400 Alb.D.III 1910/16 to 2309/16.
Blue skies,
Dan-San
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 11, 2007 - 06:20 AM UTC
Ok folks while the admin gets the Campaign title untied and the knots worked out, here we go. If anything we are not going to sit on our hands. As I mentioned earlier JRatz kindly allowed me to use this thread as a home base if you will. Starting tonight this is the official thread for the Bloody April 1917 Air Campaign.Now lets get to it! Any questions post here and I'll do my best to help. JRatz has volunteered to be my wingman in this endeavour. If you have any questions concerning any German involved combat that took place between April 1 - 30 , 1917 I probably can help answer. No brag just facts.
As for me I'll have a few details on my build by next week.
jRatz
Joined: March 06, 2004
KitMaker: 1,171 posts
AeroScale: 151 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 11, 2007 - 08:28 AM UTC
Hi Guys,
Welcome to Bloody April !!!
Stephen is in charge and is also the expert -- I'm here to hold his coat , fetch water and provide comic relief, but I've also been known to know a wee bit about British stuff ...
John
Welcome to Bloody April !!!
Stephen is in charge and is also the expert -- I'm here to hold his coat , fetch water and provide comic relief, but I've also been known to know a wee bit about British stuff ...
John
Lucky13
Joined: June 01, 2006
KitMaker: 1,707 posts
AeroScale: 1,119 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 11, 2007 - 11:30 PM UTC
To Eduard: I WANT A 1/48 SOPWITH PUP!!!
Can we put up a list of us here on the Bloody April campaign and which combatants that we're building? Since we're building two (if I remember correctly) what can we do if we only find one of the combatants in the scale that we're building, should we have a backup plan? I have a
time finding a 1/48 Sopwith Pup for my alter ego Bruno Loerzer to play with. Can I change combatants?
Can we put up a list of us here on the Bloody April campaign and which combatants that we're building? Since we're building two (if I remember correctly) what can we do if we only find one of the combatants in the scale that we're building, should we have a backup plan? I have a
time finding a 1/48 Sopwith Pup for my alter ego Bruno Loerzer to play with. Can I change combatants?JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Friday, January 12, 2007 - 03:07 AM UTC
Quoted Text
To Eduard: I WANT A 1/48 SOPWITH PUP!!!
Can we put up a list of us here on the Bloody April campaign and which combatants that we're building? Since we're building two (if I remember correctly) what can we do if we only find one of the combatants in the scale that we're building, should we have a backup plan? I have a
Certainly no lock-ins at this time. With so much out there we will give everyone a chance to check out various combats and gather information. I want a Sopwith Pup too!
Lucky13
Joined: June 01, 2006
KitMaker: 1,707 posts
AeroScale: 1,119 posts
Posted: Friday, January 12, 2007 - 04:36 AM UTC
I think that I'll change to Kurt Wolff instead for Bruno Loerzer. Kurt shot down 22 E/A in April 1917, that gives me something to work on. 
:-)
Any ideas what kind of markings his Albatros had? Was it a III or V?
Back to research....
:-)
:-) Any ideas what kind of markings his Albatros had? Was it a III or V?
Back to research....
:-) jRatz
Joined: March 06, 2004
KitMaker: 1,171 posts
AeroScale: 151 posts
Posted: Friday, January 12, 2007 - 07:35 AM UTC
Sopwith Pup.
Get a 1-1/2 Strutter pregnant !!!!
Seriously, you'll have to haunt E-Bay -- I have in last couple months got an 10-year old Eduard kit and also an Aeroclub Vac kit, both in 1/48 ... Listings are rare for both the Pup & Tripe in 1/48 ...
No you may not have them ...
I agree that Eduard and/or Roden need to get the Pup & Tripe back in production ...
John
Get a 1-1/2 Strutter pregnant !!!!
Seriously, you'll have to haunt E-Bay -- I have in last couple months got an 10-year old Eduard kit and also an Aeroclub Vac kit, both in 1/48 ... Listings are rare for both the Pup & Tripe in 1/48 ...
No you may not have them ...
I agree that Eduard and/or Roden need to get the Pup & Tripe back in production ...
John
JackFlash
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Friday, January 12, 2007 - 11:00 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I think that I'll change to Kurt Wolff instead for Bruno Loerzer. Kurt shot down 22 E/A in April 1917, that gives me something to work on.
Any ideas what kind of markings his Albatros had? Was it a III or V?
Back to research....
In April 1917 Wolff reportedly flew a D.III ( too early for the D.V.) One was painted purple at least the fuselage. (I kid you not.) Somewhere around April/ May he began to fly Alb. D.III 632/17 with a red fuselage and green (?) tail.
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