_GOTOBOTTOM
Early Aviation
Discuss World War I and the early years of aviation thru 1934.
Hosted by Jim Starkweather
Roden 1:48 SE 5a some build notes.
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Friday, February 01, 2008 - 04:09 PM UTC
Greetings all;

In tinkering with 4 @ 1/48 Roden SE 5a kits and one Part of Poland Set made for the Roden kit I and preping myself for the coming large (1/32) scale group build to begin in the very near future.

For those of you that have this little 1/48 gem in your stash hopefully I will be able to clarify and concerns you might have with this kit. First there is the "see through effect from the engine exhausts through to the other side. I went with doing some blanks that will give the impression of a full engine installation.
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Friday, February 01, 2008 - 04:24 PM UTC
Here is what I mean.


Also there are a few instruments that need to be idenitified as dials not gauges. Part of Poland 1/48 scale fret is also in need of this.

JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Friday, February 01, 2008 - 04:31 PM UTC

Both concerns are to the left of center on the panel.They are the fuel setting dial and what looks like an access to the fuel filter.
CaptainA
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Indiana, United States
Joined: May 14, 2007
KitMaker: 3,117 posts
AeroScale: 2,270 posts
Posted: Saturday, February 02, 2008 - 12:34 PM UTC
Thanks Stephen. I have the kit and the Parts AM set. I am going to be watching this thread closely.
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 03, 2008 - 02:47 PM UTC
No worries. Many of you may be aware that Roden did a first issue of the Viper kit where the lower wing was essentailly missing an extra rib. After listening to modelers on the internet they began to offer replacements and then fixed the problem by adding the new lower wing to the exisating sprue and deleting the inaccurate one.

Roden has always provided excellent service to its customers especially in their water slide decals. I have heard descriptions from "they're Crap!" to "I can use these." At first their decals were of a less that stellar quality from what most of us are used to. But again Roden listens to its customers and has been offering replacement decal sheets to many who send in requests.

Now back to the kits. For references I recommend;
“Aircraft of the Aces #78 - SE 5/ 5a Aces of WWI” by Franks, Osprey Aircraft of the Aces series. 2007.
for review click here
“British Fighter Units 1917-18" by A. Revell, Osprey Pub. Ltd. 1978.
“Fighting Fifty Six” by A. Revell, Aeroplane Monthly Pp. 591 - 596, Nov. 1976
“S.E. 5 Fighter Supreme” by J.M. Bruce, Aeroplane Monthly Pp.264 - 269, May 1977
“S.E. 5 Fighter Supreme” by J.M. Bruce, Aeroplane Monthly Pp. 327 - 331, June 1977.
“S.E. 5 Fighter Supreme” by J.M. Bruce, Aeroplane Monthly Pp. 355 - 360, July 1977.
“S.E. 5 Fighter Supreme” by J.M. Bruce, Aeroplane Monthly Pp. 437 - 442, August 1977.
“S.E. 5 Fighter Supreme” by J.M. Bruce, Aeroplane Monthly Pp. 493 - 498, September 1977.
“S.E. 5 Fighter Supreme” by J.M. Bruce, Aeroplane Monthly Pp. 552 - 558, October 1977.
“S.E. 5 Fighter Supreme” by J.M. Bruce, Aeroplane Monthly Pp. 608 - 613, November 1977.
RAF SE 5a by J.M. Bruce, Datafile Special, Windsock pub.1993.
Royal Flying Corps in WWI by R. Rimell, Osprey Vintage Warbirds series #1, 1985.
The SE 5 by J.M. Bruce, Profile Publications #103, 1966.
The SE 5a by J. M. Bruce, Profile Publications #1, 1964.
Kitboy
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Gelderland, Netherlands
Joined: July 20, 2006
KitMaker: 258 posts
AeroScale: 256 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 03, 2008 - 08:52 PM UTC
Yep,

I 'm one of those who's got this one on his stash. I am planning to do it this year, but there are other kits in the pipeline. Currently doing Roden's Strutter. After this it's going to be Karaya's Buzzard. Then it's one step back (in scale) Roden's Gotha. When these are finished the SE5a may turn up. But,.. looking at some company's planned releases for this year, things may change.

Anyway, nice to have this topic started!

Cheers, Nico
RAGIII
_VISITCOMMUNITY
North Carolina, United States
Joined: June 19, 2007
KitMaker: 604 posts
AeroScale: 600 posts
Posted: Monday, February 04, 2008 - 09:45 AM UTC
Stephen, As you are aware I have built the Viper version almost OOB. I do have the part PE set for a planned conversion to an SE5 (second Batch) with the early engine and late wings. I am looking forward to your build.
RAGIII

PS I plan to do Protheros' bird from 56 squadron.
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Monday, February 04, 2008 - 10:34 AM UTC
Greetings Rick!

Please feel free to contribute to this thread. I really admire your build. Maybe even a little instruction on your wrinkled effect may be just the ticket here?
RAGIII
_VISITCOMMUNITY
North Carolina, United States
Joined: June 19, 2007
KitMaker: 604 posts
AeroScale: 600 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 07, 2008 - 09:22 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Greetings Rick!

Please feel free to contribute to this thread. I really admire your build. Maybe even a little instruction on your wrinkled effect may be just the ticket here?


Thanks Stephen although It is pretty ordinary compared to the work you do! That being said here is a breif description of my Wrinkled fabric method:
I always try to keep things as simple as possible. Looking at pictures I began to think that the fabric wrinkles on the SE in scale looked like a BADLY hand painted finish. I use an Acrylic paint designed for use on Ceramics, Delta Ceramicoat. I apply a thick coating in the area I want the wrinkles with a wide brush. I then use a pointed brush dragged through the thick paint to create troughs or wrinkles. with practice you can alter the size and shape to meet the pattern you want. I then smooth out the edges blending them into the fuselage. Finally after the ceramicoat is dry, I use Polyscale paint and hand paint the fabric area. This leaves smaller streaks representing the overall rough texture seen on ses in this area. I have attached a picture of the finished product:



Link Broken 2013.
RAGIII
_VISITCOMMUNITY
North Carolina, United States
Joined: June 19, 2007
KitMaker: 604 posts
AeroScale: 600 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 07, 2008 - 09:38 AM UTC


Seem to have gone brain dead tonight so here is the link to the photo. Maybe Stephen can fix my inability to get the picture where it belongs :-)
RAGIII

Link Broken 2013
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 07, 2008 - 02:49 PM UTC
Nothing up my t-shirt sleeve. . . presto!
CaptainA
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Indiana, United States
Joined: May 14, 2007
KitMaker: 3,117 posts
AeroScale: 2,270 posts
Posted: Friday, February 08, 2008 - 02:17 AM UTC
Did you have any problems getting the Parts AM Set? I ordered mine, and it took almost 6 months to come in.
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Friday, February 08, 2008 - 03:15 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Did you have any problems getting the Parts AM Set? I ordered mine, and it took almost 6 months to come in.


Greetings Carl! I ordered my 1/48 from Jadar (two different times) and got them both in about two weeks. I ordered the 1/32 scale set from MisterkitUSA and got them in about 10 days. Gadzooks and Hot Marimba! Now thats a set.
Rittersbach
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Texas, United States
Joined: August 16, 2007
KitMaker: 83 posts
AeroScale: 80 posts
Posted: Friday, February 08, 2008 - 04:28 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Gadzooks and Hot Marimba! Now thats a set.


I seem to remember saying this when I first laid eyes on my wife

RAGIII
_VISITCOMMUNITY
North Carolina, United States
Joined: June 19, 2007
KitMaker: 604 posts
AeroScale: 600 posts
Posted: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - 03:06 AM UTC
Stephen, I like the way you are closing off the openings in the side and creating an impression of whats going on with the engine. Any progress since your last post?
RAGIII
P.S. Thanks for the help on the picture!
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 - 03:32 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Stephen, I like the way you are closing off the openings in the side and creating an impression of whats going on with the engine. Any progress since your last post?
RAGIII P.S. Thanks for the help on the picture!


Greetings Rick,

After closing up the fuselages (4 of them) I am beginning a bit of drilling for the pilot holes for the rigging.
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 24, 2008 - 01:09 PM UTC
Ok we are starting to mount top wings. As a note for you all, the small spurs on the ends of the kit struts (PP 8, 9, & 12 X 2) are actually the tie ends for the "X" bracings between the fore and aft interplane struts. If you decide to use the Part PE these plastic items will need to be removed. Also if you rig the kit your rigging pilot holes will need to parallel the strut pilot / locatior hole.By the way there are 42 rigging lines to do.
Dwaynewilly
_VISITCOMMUNITY
New York, United States
Joined: December 15, 2006
KitMaker: 365 posts
AeroScale: 344 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 24, 2008 - 03:17 PM UTC
"By the way, there are 42 rigging lines to do. "

Thanks for reminding me! Thats more than twice what an Albatros has and it still only has one bay! Someone sure made alot of money selling wire to the English aircraft industry! I'm still trying to get pumped to build one of these things and you go ahead and say something like that!

Look forward to seeing the kits.
Dwayne
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Sunday, February 24, 2008 - 04:35 PM UTC
Greetings Dwayne 2 very important thing to remember!
A. Breath regularly
B. Keep repeating "It Is only a model, it Is only a model. . . .'
RAGIII
_VISITCOMMUNITY
North Carolina, United States
Joined: June 19, 2007
KitMaker: 604 posts
AeroScale: 600 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 28, 2008 - 12:37 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Ok we are starting to mount top wings. As a note for you all, the small spurs on the ends of the kit struts (PP 8, 9, & 12 X 2) are actually the tie ends for the "X" bracings between the fore and aft interplane struts. If you decode to use the Part PE these plastic items will need to be removed. Also if you rig the kit your rigging pilot holes will need to parallel the strut pilot / locatior hole.By the way there are 42 rigging lines to do.


I think I came up with 46, probably overcomplicated my build as usual
RAGIII
CaptainA
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Indiana, United States
Joined: May 14, 2007
KitMaker: 3,117 posts
AeroScale: 2,270 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 02, 2008 - 11:04 AM UTC
What's a few extra brace wires. You could probably get away with putting on 70 or 80 if you really wanted to.
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Monday, June 30, 2008 - 03:38 PM UTC
Greetings all;
Yes the four 1/48 builds ar progressing nicely. Top wings on two and the other two are about to be added. I have plans for another partial kit & Part of poland kit crash. Along with their big brother (the 1/32 kit ) I am having a baang up time!

Here is another build note. when it comes to the cabane struts (PP 14 X 2 & 15 X2) These parts fit better if you "az" or scrape down the lower inside portions that meet the cut out slots on the top decking. Also it helps if you clip off the lower attachment ends to these as well. They look like they were malformed but were probably added to extend the cabane struts. They really don't need these.
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Monday, June 30, 2008 - 03:48 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Here is what I mean.

Also there are a few instruments that need to be idenitified as dials not gauges. Part of Poland 1/48 scale fret is also in need of this.


here is an SE 5a instrument panel.
JackFlash
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 25, 2004
KitMaker: 11,669 posts
AeroScale: 11,011 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 05, 2008 - 01:02 PM UTC
Greetings all. When you can't find it in print go to the author. Alex Revell is one of the finest research fiends on the subject of WWI British aviation. Specifically 56 sqn RFC / RAF and the famed SE5a.


Quoted Text

StephenLawson sends; Hey Alex, There were two type of control columns? The stick and the stick with a loop at the top. Which came first? Did it depend on the manufacturer?



Quoted Text

alex_revell sends back;
Stephen,
I can only tell you what Charles, the engineering officer of 56, told me. I can't vouch for it, but he said that when McCudden joined 56 he did not like the method of firing the guns, which was a kind of grip on the stick, rather like a brake lever on a motor bike. McCudden said that this tended to jerk the aeroplane a little, throw the aim off, and asked Charles to fit his SE with the spade grip as used in the Camel. McCudden asked for a very light pressure to fire the guns - ounces. By memory it was three or four.
Best I can do, I'm afraid.
Alex

mpalao
_VISITCOMMUNITY
Madrid, Spain / España
Joined: June 19, 2005
KitMaker: 243 posts
AeroScale: 70 posts
Posted: Tuesday, July 15, 2008 - 10:08 PM UTC
Dear all.
Stephen I need to know in more detail the paint type used in your wrinkled fabric method. This paint dries slowly allowing with a brush dragged the wrinkled area. I remember one review using putty in order to look this effect.

Could you help me.
thanks in advance
 _GOTOTOP