CAT WALK ROPE INSTALLATION
A couple of work-in-progress pics.
I hope I am not boring the lurkers. At the very least you're being treated to a bravura OCD performance.
In do expect to get the inner bomb racks installed this weekend, with completed ropes.
World War II
Discuss WWII and the era directly before and after the war from 1935-1949.
Discuss WWII and the era directly before and after the war from 1935-1949.
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1/48 B-17F Build - 303rd BGs Luscious Lady
Posted: Saturday, April 25, 2015 - 10:44 PM UTC
Joel_W
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Posted: Saturday, April 25, 2015 - 11:42 PM UTC
Brian,
The rope really looks "in scale". Does it fit through the eyelets or did you have to glue it on top? Either way, the finished effect should be spectacular.
"bravura OCD performance". Very well said.
You just had to know that I couldn't let that just slide on by.
Joel
The rope really looks "in scale". Does it fit through the eyelets or did you have to glue it on top? Either way, the finished effect should be spectacular.
"bravura OCD performance". Very well said.
You just had to know that I couldn't let that just slide on by.
Joel
Posted: Saturday, April 25, 2015 - 11:56 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Brian,
The rope really looks "in scale". Does it fit through the eyelets or did you have to glue it on top?
Joel
It fits perfectly. Nice mating of materials. Glueing the ends together with crazy glue after passing through the eyes.
Joel_W
Associate Editor
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Posted: Sunday, April 26, 2015 - 12:11 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextBrian,
The rope really looks "in scale". Does it fit through the eyelets or did you have to glue it on top?
Joel
It fits perfectly. Nice mating of materials. Glueing the ends together with crazy glue after passing through the eyes.
Brian,
That's the difference between us. If it was me, the rope would have just been just a touch to large, so I would have had to figure out how to ream every eyelet out.
Joel
thegirl
Alberta, Canada
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Posted: Sunday, April 26, 2015 - 05:42 AM UTC
Really enjoying your build sir !
Terri
Terri
AbramJ
Arizona, United States
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Posted: Sunday, April 26, 2015 - 09:39 AM UTC
Looking great Brian. The first picture in your post looks like you ripped the side off of an actual B-17.
blue-red-blue
England - South East, United Kingdom
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Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2015 - 09:05 AM UTC
Brian, the reason i joined this site today after a few years of watching from the sidelines, was down to builds such as yours here...
The level of detailing is beyond words, I think I aged 10 years just looking at some of the things you were doing and the depth of detailing you were taking it to.... and this is from an Armour nut lol.
Keep up the amazing work.
Jon
The level of detailing is beyond words, I think I aged 10 years just looking at some of the things you were doing and the depth of detailing you were taking it to.... and this is from an Armour nut lol.
Keep up the amazing work.
Jon
Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2015 - 04:07 PM UTC
ONE INNER BOMB RACK INSTALLED, AND SOME THANK YOU'S
First I want to thank Terri, Abram and Jon for your very kind comments. Believe me when I say, as I'm sure I have before, that I never planned to get to this "level of detail," i.e. madness, when I started this build. It became kind of incrementalism run riot, as in, "Well, maybe I could add this," and then afterwards, "Well, why not add that to this," etc.
Thank heavens the space in the real thing, after some operational use, was as grungy as the pictures here. I'm not sure I could have built this area factory-fresh "clean." Thus, "realism" is a happy accident covering up many little sins. I think that's true of the build as a whole.
I have never before built anything even remotely this complex. The key to doing it has less to do with modeling "skillz" than controlled persistence, and patience, like I have to work in slow motion and focus on one bit at a time rather than the whole. As I have also said before, you have to think of each part, almost, as a "little kit" by itself.
Anyway, "moving right along," here are two shots of the first inner bomb rack installed, with catwalk ropes.
I schmeared [a great Yiddish Americanism if ever there was one, lookit up] the catwalk ropes in the pic with Future to stiffen them and eliminate a certain "hairiness" in the threads, and I also touched it up slightly with off white craft acrylic paint, the same as I use on electrical wiring. Looks OK IMO.
I like the second picture more, because it gives a better view of how this will look when complete.
More to follow over the weekend.
First I want to thank Terri, Abram and Jon for your very kind comments. Believe me when I say, as I'm sure I have before, that I never planned to get to this "level of detail," i.e. madness, when I started this build. It became kind of incrementalism run riot, as in, "Well, maybe I could add this," and then afterwards, "Well, why not add that to this," etc.
Thank heavens the space in the real thing, after some operational use, was as grungy as the pictures here. I'm not sure I could have built this area factory-fresh "clean." Thus, "realism" is a happy accident covering up many little sins. I think that's true of the build as a whole.
I have never before built anything even remotely this complex. The key to doing it has less to do with modeling "skillz" than controlled persistence, and patience, like I have to work in slow motion and focus on one bit at a time rather than the whole. As I have also said before, you have to think of each part, almost, as a "little kit" by itself.
Anyway, "moving right along," here are two shots of the first inner bomb rack installed, with catwalk ropes.
I schmeared [a great Yiddish Americanism if ever there was one, lookit up] the catwalk ropes in the pic with Future to stiffen them and eliminate a certain "hairiness" in the threads, and I also touched it up slightly with off white craft acrylic paint, the same as I use on electrical wiring. Looks OK IMO.
I like the second picture more, because it gives a better view of how this will look when complete.
More to follow over the weekend.
Joel_W
Associate Editor
New York, United States
Joined: December 04, 2010
KitMaker: 11,666 posts
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Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2015 - 05:15 PM UTC
Brian,
You just made my day!! I'm making breakfast of coffee, a toasted bagel, and a Smear of Philadelphia Cream Cheese.
It's hard to see in the pictures, but the rope sure doesn't look like it has the frizzes, and the color does indeed look like real natural hemp rope.
Your continued level of detail and excellence of execution just amazes me.
I'm really looking forward to how you handle all four engines, which I'm guessing each will be to a different level of detail, as well as full blown wheel wells.
Of course the next milestone is when you button up the two fuselage halves.
Joel
You just made my day!! I'm making breakfast of coffee, a toasted bagel, and a Smear of Philadelphia Cream Cheese.
It's hard to see in the pictures, but the rope sure doesn't look like it has the frizzes, and the color does indeed look like real natural hemp rope.
Your continued level of detail and excellence of execution just amazes me.
I'm really looking forward to how you handle all four engines, which I'm guessing each will be to a different level of detail, as well as full blown wheel wells.
Of course the next milestone is when you button up the two fuselage halves.
Joel
Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2015 - 05:32 PM UTC
Quoted Text
how you handle all four engines, which I'm guessing each will be to a different level of detail, as well as full blown wheel wells.
Of course the next milestone is when you button up the two fuselage halves.
Joel
The engines will be fun. Probably my favorite part of the A/C. As for wheel wells, yes, though I'm not going "to reinvent the wheel" there. There's another online build where the guy has a how-to presentation and I will use that as a guide. Plus, my NC friend will be helping me with the hard parts.
Of course, there are a few things to be completed before the fuselage gets buttoned up!
Joel_W
Associate Editor
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Joined: December 04, 2010
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Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2015 - 06:00 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted Texthow you handle all four engines, which I'm guessing each will be to a different level of detail, as well as full blown wheel wells.
Of course the next milestone is when you button up the two fuselage halves.
Joel
The engines will be fun. Probably my favorite part of the A/C. As for wheel wells, yes, though I'm not going "to reinvent the wheel" there. There's another online build where the guy has a how-to presentation and I will use that as a guide. Plus, my NC friend will be helping me with the hard parts.
Of course, there are a few things to be completed before the fuselage gets buttoned up!
Brian,
After seeing what your friend was able to accomplish with the turret, I'm sure that we're in for some real surprises.
Joel
Posted: Saturday, May 02, 2015 - 08:20 AM UTC
INNER BOMB RACKS COMPLETE
A milestone on this mad quest. See below.
There are inevitable clean-up items here and there, but at least I got the second inner bomb rack in without any disasters like broken parts, eye bolts for the ropes pulling out of the bomb rack and bulkhead attachment points, etc. I consider it an accomplishment just to have gotten the racks and ropes more or less properly aligned.
One of the small advertised surprises is plainly visible here: the electrical cable running along the bottom of the catwalk to provide juice to the bomb release mechanisms in the inner bomb racks.
In all candor, I'm not feeling particularly triumphant about this tonight. It remains something of "a mess" where I feel the detail makes up for the many flaws I see. Like I said last time, I don't think I could have done a "clean build" in this space even if I had wanted to. There is just too much inside and waaaaaay too much scratch-building, fitting dissimilar parts and messing around gluing in little plastic & resin bits, wires, little decals etc. for it to be "flawless". .
But, it will get the job done looking through the radio room door from the top hatch, and if somebody picks the completed kit up and looks through the bottom. Plus, "I build for myself."
I have to fit the left upper ceiling in next. I'm going to have to build up the forward edge up so there is a proper mating surface with the forward bulkhead, and then there are some electrical wires and pipes that need to be added to connect to the front bulkhead.
Then it's on to the lower port bulkhead, and finis till I get to the bomb bay doors way down the road.
A milestone on this mad quest. See below.
There are inevitable clean-up items here and there, but at least I got the second inner bomb rack in without any disasters like broken parts, eye bolts for the ropes pulling out of the bomb rack and bulkhead attachment points, etc. I consider it an accomplishment just to have gotten the racks and ropes more or less properly aligned.
One of the small advertised surprises is plainly visible here: the electrical cable running along the bottom of the catwalk to provide juice to the bomb release mechanisms in the inner bomb racks.
In all candor, I'm not feeling particularly triumphant about this tonight. It remains something of "a mess" where I feel the detail makes up for the many flaws I see. Like I said last time, I don't think I could have done a "clean build" in this space even if I had wanted to. There is just too much inside and waaaaaay too much scratch-building, fitting dissimilar parts and messing around gluing in little plastic & resin bits, wires, little decals etc. for it to be "flawless". .
But, it will get the job done looking through the radio room door from the top hatch, and if somebody picks the completed kit up and looks through the bottom. Plus, "I build for myself."
I have to fit the left upper ceiling in next. I'm going to have to build up the forward edge up so there is a proper mating surface with the forward bulkhead, and then there are some electrical wires and pipes that need to be added to connect to the front bulkhead.
Then it's on to the lower port bulkhead, and finis till I get to the bomb bay doors way down the road.
Posted: Saturday, May 02, 2015 - 09:10 PM UTC
BOTTOMS UP
Gap at top right bulkhead needs to be filled. As we lawyers say, "Further sayeth affiant not." And yes, I actually saw that arcania on a contemporary legal document once!
Gap at top right bulkhead needs to be filled. As we lawyers say, "Further sayeth affiant not." And yes, I actually saw that arcania on a contemporary legal document once!
Joel_W
Associate Editor
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Joined: December 04, 2010
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Posted: Sunday, May 03, 2015 - 02:17 AM UTC
Brian,
Those bomb racks look incredible. The amount of detail you've added to the bomb bay is way past anything I've ever seen.
Joel
Those bomb racks look incredible. The amount of detail you've added to the bomb bay is way past anything I've ever seen.
Joel
Posted: Sunday, May 03, 2015 - 08:55 AM UTC
Hi Brian!
Still following along and I must say that the bomb bay is looking great!
Cheers Rob.
Still following along and I must say that the bomb bay is looking great!
Cheers Rob.
Posted: Thursday, May 07, 2015 - 08:43 PM UTC
OH MY! OH DEAR!
I believe this
is known as a "blivid problem" in our hobby (and in other walks of life). See blivid.
This occurred despite your builder's best efforts to get the ceiling perfectly centered (which I believe I did).
Here are some other views.
In fact, the careful observer may suspect that I have exaggerated the problem through deceptive camera angles.
Maybe so (to make myself look better if I fix it, no doubt).
The reality is that I knew this was coming and, as I see it, "it isn't as bad as it looks." I believe it can be corrected with some strategic cuts and sanding while preserving an illusion of symmetry.
Something to do over the weekend.
I believe this
is known as a "blivid problem" in our hobby (and in other walks of life). See blivid.
This occurred despite your builder's best efforts to get the ceiling perfectly centered (which I believe I did).
Here are some other views.
In fact, the careful observer may suspect that I have exaggerated the problem through deceptive camera angles.
Maybe so (to make myself look better if I fix it, no doubt).
The reality is that I knew this was coming and, as I see it, "it isn't as bad as it looks." I believe it can be corrected with some strategic cuts and sanding while preserving an illusion of symmetry.
Something to do over the weekend.
chukw1
California, United States
Joined: November 28, 2007
KitMaker: 817 posts
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Joined: November 28, 2007
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Posted: Thursday, May 07, 2015 - 09:17 PM UTC
Good gravy! Something for the weekend indeed- your patience is admirable! Brian, I was able to poke around "Nine O Nine" this past week- would any pics be of help?
Cheers!
chuk
Cheers!
chuk
Posted: Thursday, May 07, 2015 - 09:50 PM UTC
Thanks Chuk:
As I said, I think it can be fixed. I was surprised, however, to realize that even if I glued the lower bulkhead to the right side as a complete sub assembly, there would be a clearance problem when it came to putting the fuselage halves together.
In any event, it should be near impossible to see a significant lack of symmetry when the fuselage is finally buttoned up. The port lower bulkhead will be hiding behind the edge where the door hinges are. But, who really needs this?
As I said, I think it can be fixed. I was surprised, however, to realize that even if I glued the lower bulkhead to the right side as a complete sub assembly, there would be a clearance problem when it came to putting the fuselage halves together.
In any event, it should be near impossible to see a significant lack of symmetry when the fuselage is finally buttoned up. The port lower bulkhead will be hiding behind the edge where the door hinges are. But, who really needs this?
Joel_W
Associate Editor
New York, United States
Joined: December 04, 2010
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Posted: Thursday, May 07, 2015 - 11:11 PM UTC
Brian,
I sure must have led a sheltered life, as I honestly never heard of that word before. But since I checked out your link, I'm adding it to my stagnant vocabulary.
I see the problem, but I think that the magnification in the photograph makes the problem worse then it is. From the angle in the pictures, the alignment looks to be off just a few mm. And from what you've said, it will be nearly impossible to see once the fuselage is closed up, especially since you'd have to turn the B-17F over, and most likely point it out to whomever is viewing your work.
I went back and looks at the last several pictures, and it's centered dead on. Does the movement occur as you squeeze both fuselage halves together? If that's the case, why not glue the Bombay into one half, then work on the fit so that the other fuselage half mates correctly?
Joel
I sure must have led a sheltered life, as I honestly never heard of that word before. But since I checked out your link, I'm adding it to my stagnant vocabulary.
I see the problem, but I think that the magnification in the photograph makes the problem worse then it is. From the angle in the pictures, the alignment looks to be off just a few mm. And from what you've said, it will be nearly impossible to see once the fuselage is closed up, especially since you'd have to turn the B-17F over, and most likely point it out to whomever is viewing your work.
I went back and looks at the last several pictures, and it's centered dead on. Does the movement occur as you squeeze both fuselage halves together? If that's the case, why not glue the Bombay into one half, then work on the fit so that the other fuselage half mates correctly?
Joel
Posted: Thursday, May 07, 2015 - 11:45 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Brian,
From the angle in the pictures, the alignment looks to be off just a few mm. * * * If that's the case, why not glue the Bombay into one half, then work on the fit so that the other fuselage half mates correctly?
Joel
I'll consider that. I agree that the pictures give a somewhat distorted view, from almost any angle, and was fessing up to that in the post.
Bottom line is that this isn't a show-stopper.
Joel_W
Associate Editor
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Joined: December 04, 2010
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Posted: Friday, May 08, 2015 - 12:53 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextBrian,
From the angle in the pictures, the alignment looks to be off just a few mm. * * * If that's the case, why not glue the Bombay into one half, then work on the fit so that the other fuselage half mates correctly?
Joel
I'll consider that. I agree that the pictures give a somewhat distorted view, from almost any angle, and was fessing up to that in the post.
Bottom line is that this isn't a show-stopper.
Brian,
Sorry, but I beg to differ. So far it's the star of the show.
Joel
Posted: Saturday, May 09, 2015 - 08:31 PM UTC
TRYING TOO HARD/WARTS AND ALL
OK, an update as it were:
First, a view of the left front bulkhead corner, with some added piping that really adds little IMHO.
Second, a view of the port lower bulkhead, trimmed/butchered to fit.
Of course, there is clean-up and detail to add/reinstall.
Third, a preliminary view of the bomb bay with the fuselage together.
Of course we really won't know "what it looks like" till the fuselage is firmly glued together and "all the angles" have been covered, so to speak.
For your edification and amusement let me say (again) that simply gluing the fuselage halves together so they actually fit will be a major accomplishment. With the port bomb bay almost intact I had to step back and take a "big picture" look at this problem. In the process the pilots' compartment left bulkhead is temporarily out, as are the pilots seats (again!!) The issue is one of clearances.
Left pilot bulkhead rubs against seat bracket, loosens it, oxygen bottle pops off, left rear pilot after bulkhead needs to be trimmed down, etc. These sub-assemblies are best left out till just before I glue the fuselage halves together, I think. I will also remove two oxygen bottles from the top, port after rack to bring the cockpit "to spec." When you look at the four-bottle rear configuration, there is no way any 1/48 crewman could squeeze past the turret.
I am strangely calm in the midst of this chaos, and actually don't feel I'm going backwards. I just want to get the bomb bay done and move aft to the radio room. That will be the last space where I think major mods to the fuselage interior will be required, though "major" is a relative term.
Will probably have another post up fairly soon, but I'm having a hard time imagining how/when/if this will ever get finished.
OK, an update as it were:
First, a view of the left front bulkhead corner, with some added piping that really adds little IMHO.
Second, a view of the port lower bulkhead, trimmed/butchered to fit.
Of course, there is clean-up and detail to add/reinstall.
Third, a preliminary view of the bomb bay with the fuselage together.
Of course we really won't know "what it looks like" till the fuselage is firmly glued together and "all the angles" have been covered, so to speak.
For your edification and amusement let me say (again) that simply gluing the fuselage halves together so they actually fit will be a major accomplishment. With the port bomb bay almost intact I had to step back and take a "big picture" look at this problem. In the process the pilots' compartment left bulkhead is temporarily out, as are the pilots seats (again!!) The issue is one of clearances.
Left pilot bulkhead rubs against seat bracket, loosens it, oxygen bottle pops off, left rear pilot after bulkhead needs to be trimmed down, etc. These sub-assemblies are best left out till just before I glue the fuselage halves together, I think. I will also remove two oxygen bottles from the top, port after rack to bring the cockpit "to spec." When you look at the four-bottle rear configuration, there is no way any 1/48 crewman could squeeze past the turret.
I am strangely calm in the midst of this chaos, and actually don't feel I'm going backwards. I just want to get the bomb bay done and move aft to the radio room. That will be the last space where I think major mods to the fuselage interior will be required, though "major" is a relative term.
Will probably have another post up fairly soon, but I'm having a hard time imagining how/when/if this will ever get finished.
Joel_W
Associate Editor
New York, United States
Joined: December 04, 2010
KitMaker: 11,666 posts
AeroScale: 7,410 posts
Joined: December 04, 2010
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Posted: Sunday, May 10, 2015 - 03:16 AM UTC
Brian,
Certainly a major accomplishment in just test fitting the Bombay and taping the fuselage halves together. Personally, I do feel your "pain" as you had to remove the seats and bulkhead once again. Once I read the word: Clearances, I had to wonder just how much of an issue is it? The only good thing is that it's easy to decrease then increase to get parts to fit correctly. Just don't break any of those beautiful seats you made.
If you can live with just two oxygen bottles, then go for it. It's as per specs, and only you will ever know that there was a one time effort for four bottles.
Once you finally get the fuselage glued together, you're past half way. The wings and engines should go much quicker. In any event I'm staying the course till the very end.
Joel
Certainly a major accomplishment in just test fitting the Bombay and taping the fuselage halves together. Personally, I do feel your "pain" as you had to remove the seats and bulkhead once again. Once I read the word: Clearances, I had to wonder just how much of an issue is it? The only good thing is that it's easy to decrease then increase to get parts to fit correctly. Just don't break any of those beautiful seats you made.
If you can live with just two oxygen bottles, then go for it. It's as per specs, and only you will ever know that there was a one time effort for four bottles.
Once you finally get the fuselage glued together, you're past half way. The wings and engines should go much quicker. In any event I'm staying the course till the very end.
Joel
Posted: Sunday, May 10, 2015 - 05:30 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Certainly a major accomplishment in just test fitting the Bombay and taping the fuselage halves together. * * * Clearances, I had to wonder just how much of an issue is it? * * *
If you can live with just two oxygen bottles, then go for it. It's as per specs, and only you will ever know that there was a one time effort for four bottles.
Joel
Thanks for your support Joel.
I suppose this effort is something you couldn't pay someone else to do. [Private joke].
The clearance issue was not that great, but I really had to correct the gap between the pilots' compartment and the roof of the radio room. I believe I have finally located the main sticking points and eliminated them. The fuselage will be a slow, section by section gluing job, beginning with the bottom. But it should go OK.
Haven't made up my mind on the oxygen bottles yet.
Boy do I look forward to getting the fuselage done!
Joel_W
Associate Editor
New York, United States
Joined: December 04, 2010
KitMaker: 11,666 posts
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Joined: December 04, 2010
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Posted: Sunday, May 10, 2015 - 04:56 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted Text
Certainly a major accomplishment in just test fitting the Bombay and taping the fuselage halves together. * * * Clearances, I had to wonder just how much of an issue is it? * * *
If you can live with just two oxygen bottles, then go for it. It's as per specs, and only you will ever know that there was a one time effort for four bottles.
Joel
Thanks for your support Joel.
I suppose this effort is something you couldn't pay someone else to do. [Private joke].
The clearance issue was not that great, but I really had to correct the gap between the pilots' compartment and the roof of the radio room. I believe I have finally located the main sticking points and eliminated them. The fuselage will be a slow, section by section gluing job, beginning with the bottom. But it should go OK.
Haven't made up my mind on the oxygen bottles yet.
Boy do I look forward to getting the fuselage done!
Brian,
I get the private joke. Your efforts will be better in the end, and you have the satisfaction of knowing you did it on your own.
The main thing is that you've located all the issues, and are correcting them so that each compartment isn't an issue in a good fit within the fuselage.
And yeah, like I said, once the fuselage is in the done column, it's time for a major celebration.
Joel